Sydney Watson And Elijah Schaffer Member Podcast: Crew Has Intense Religious Debate And Tim Pisses Everyone Off


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Sydney Watson And Elijah Schaffer Member Podcast: Crew Has Intense Religious Debate And Tim Pisses Everyone Off

518 responses to “Sydney Watson And Elijah Schaffer Member Podcast: Crew Has Intense Religious Debate And Tim Pisses Everyone Off”

  1. Mr.Arnold says:

    To an logical human being, if someone tells them they “saw” god when doing drugs it just sounds that the drugs did what was intended, for them to be delusional. That was a very poor example out of Eli. It’s good he left those things in the past but “come on man!” you can’t expect that to sound rational to any critical thinking individual…

  2. Mr.Arnold says:

    I respect how Tim approaches complex subjects. Keep it up brother

  3. ryansandquist says:

    Elijah Schaffer his god forgives pedophiles and child molesters.

  4. KnuckleDragger83 says:

    Whenever a religious nut says that they will pray for me, I tell them that I will talk to my cat for them and to expect the same results.

  5. ZeWalroos says:

    Agnostic Atheism is just being more specific of your atheism and why.

  6. Chase says:

    Damn. Tim’s being ridiculous, if you want answers on religion, have a religious scholar on. Fucking stupid. And why is the Aussie bitch here. Idgaf what she has to say. They’re more cowardly and stupid than Americans

  7. rob.klebes@gmail.com says:

    As well-articulated by Dawkins, you can be:
    Gnostic Theist – You claim to KNOW there is a god or gods
    Agnostic Theist – You believe in a god or gods but do not claim to KNOW
    Agnostic Atheist – You do not believe in a god or gods but do not claim to KNOW that there are zero gods
    Gnostic Atheist – You claim to KNOW that there are no gods

    Of the four possibilities, only the agnostic positions are honest. You cannot prove a negative; the inability to find evidence is not itself evidence of absence. Gnostic theists will claim evidence, but the alleged evidence has no requirement of a god for explanation (“god of the gaps,” basically; 100% of things attributed to god really do just come down to “we didn’t find the next link in the chain yet, therefore god,” and it keeps moving back every time we do find that next link).

    • sartoraaus@gmail.com says:

      The Id and the Ego seem at odds to the ego, but, maybe the ego should let go. Often, I see reasonable people second-guess themselves by over-thinking things and not trusting their instincts; though religion is man-made perhaps the relationship with God isn’t like that at all.

    • FuddleyPJones says:

      Discovering a link does NOT negate the existence of God.
      In many ways it proves it bit it certainly doesn’t negate it.

  8. StMyles2 says:

    It would be interesting for Tim to discuss religion with Rabbi Friedman.

  9. StevenBooty says:

    I’m with Sydney on this one. Atheism is simply not believing in a god or gods. Tim is also correct about scienceism and understanding philosophy. Holy fucking shit, we were a self-taught people for so long; read philosophy, read economics, read religion; listen to Christians, atheists, Republicans, Democrats, hell, even Germans!
    Anyway, do DMT.

    • sartoraaus@gmail.com says:

      a fraction of a fraction…that’s what common sense has become. It typically serves us well to break things down into small parts that we can manage and handle, but, like a dog with a bone: we take things too far, for far to long.

  10. Bigly12025 says:

    Sydney is great and all, but she is incredibly out matched in this conversation.

  11. zackforeveryoung says:

    It’s unfortunate that a very important aspect of God has been left out of this conversation. It’s like watching people walk past each other without noticing it happened, so close yet so far. It’s a difficult concept, yet so simple, and the amount of complexity contained in such a simple concept is really fascinating. This concept I keep alluding to is called Logos.

    There is a video that goes into some really good detail about what Logos is and the role of Logos in history that I recommend everybody watch. It’s a video about Logos by Classical Theist in which he talks with Dr. E Michael Jones. Logos is such a key feature of the existence of God that no real conversation can be had without people walking past each other as I mentioned before.

  12. Chach24 says:

    Religious text seem like they were created to unite people under a common ideology to aid in humanity’s survival. The problem is that the world is a big place and people keep creating new religions. Most of the popular religions are very similar in the tenants you have to follow to reach paradise. Most try to keep you from killing, adultery (because jealousy can lead to things like murder), and homosexuality (I think because it doesn’t lead to the creation of more life which is important to a species survival). I can’t understand how the word of god can be translated by man.

    • sartoraaus@gmail.com says:

      You’re on point with pointing out the problem – which, leads to nihilism. By my humble calculations I’ve mapped out this rabbit hole you’ve discovered leads to utter nihilism.

      I can’t accept nihilism and carry on, so…

      I’ve assumed that as a mere human I must eventually admit that there is an objective reality irregardless of the infinite social constructions manipulating my perception of it, or…

      I should quit pushing the stone of eternity up the forever hill.

  13. StMyles2 says:

    Been trying to see this show in it entirety but keeps going into buffering.

  14. therealtomhellman@gmail.com says:

    Tim: “I’ve latched on to this idea, now! I don’t care what nuance there is, or what you say that’s contrary to this idea. I’m just going to keep repeating this, now, because I’ve decided it’s a gotcha to what you are saying. Nothing will sway me from it.”

  15. parbruek says:

    “Who are we to tell a God who designed all these things and systems how something should work.” UGH! Look, I’m a Catholic. And I still have to point out that this statement is horrible, because it is a philosophical dead end. If we don’t understand why something is the way it is, we should be able to A. Understand it or B. understand exactly why we can’t understand it. And there are plenty of instances of B. For instance – it is hard to understand a 5 dimensional reality at a minimum because we do not observe one directly. But when something cannot be understood, and we want to understand it, you should be able to give some explanation as to why, potentially, it cannot be grasped.

    • zackforeveryoung says:

      As a catholic myself, I think the best way to phrase this concept is when theologians and the clergy speak about “The Mystery of Faith.” The best example of this kind of mystery of faith is the trinitarian nature of God. We can attempt to describe what the trinity is, but without the mystery in and of itself being a part of the definition, it always ends up falling into some kind of heresy, whether it be placing a hierarchy within the trinity, separation of the essence of the trinity, or distinction itself in the essence of the trinity. It is truly a formulation of Logos that we have to take in good faith (pun completely intended) as a mystery. Another good example of this would be divine revelation, although not as thorough as the trinity.

      • sartoraaus@gmail.com says:

        In the Gnostic Gospel of St Thomas it describes Gnosis as being an understanding of God in a way where one just barely understands God enough to believe in God, but, doesn’t quite have enough understanding to explain the understanding to anyone else.

        I correlate this to “trusting your instincts” instead of “thinking it through.” Ultimately, we all should do both as often as possible, because, they mostly matchup (in my experience). But, shouldn’t we trust our guts when they conflict with our brains?

        It seems to cheapen people’s understanding of the relationship with God as someone tries to honestly explain it…just can’t be done.

  16. parbruek says:

    Tim, for Jesus’ sake don’t merely talk to protestants. Get a Catholic or Orthodox on there. I’m here at about 15 minutes in and am cringing because I know exactly what this guy got wrong, and exactly what you’re going to ask him. Accepting Jesus helps. But many protestants will ignore the description of the final judgement as it points out the problems of saying you NEED to accept Jesus as your lord and savior. In the description of the last judgement there are people who are like: “Jesus, who on earth are you?” And Jesus is like: “You were good to other people, so you win.” It all comes down to the mistake of Luther: the belief that belief alone saves, for he conflated faith and belief.
    So yes – you Are able to get into heaven without even encountering Jesus. It’s just not going to be as easy.

    • Ozzvilla says:

      “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son. This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that their deeds will be exposed. But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what they have done has been done in the sight of God.”
      ‭‭John‬ ‭3:16-21‬ ‭NIV‬‬
      https://www.bible.com/111/jhn.3.16-21.niv

    • DrHumu says:

      Lol, dude, he has Seamus on all the time 🤣🤣
      Also Poso.

      Some of his most frequent guests are Catholics and they are well informed ones.

    • DrHumu says:

      Lol, dude, he has Seamus on all the time 🤣🤣
      Also Poso. And Knowles.

      Some of his most frequent guests are Catholics and they are well informed ones.

  17. Psyclopse says:

    No! People who have no knowledge of Christ or the Bible do not necessarily go to hell (even from a devout Christian little ‘o’ orthodox perspective). 1 Peter 3:18-20 Says “Christ died for sins once for all, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body, but made alive by the spirit, through whom also he went and preached to those in prison who disobeyed long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built.” If he revealed himself to those who came before, why would he not also in the interests of justice reveal himself to those who came after between our temporal and eternal states.

    • parbruek says:

      Thank you! They are also ignoring Revelation 20:12, Matthew 25:40, and the entirety of Romans chapter 2. If by faith you mean just a belief in Jesus, or accepting him as your savior, that’s why we have the saying, “faith without work is dead.” (James chapter 2). For it was clear that there were some who could believe and do evil, and others who would not believe and do good from the beginning. But faith alone saves is one of the pillars of Luther.

  18. AvocadoPrime says:

    Texas is a shithole. This is coming from someone who was born in Texas and raised in Texas. My entire family is from Texas since before it became a state. Don’t go there, and definitely don’t move there if you’re from a blue state.

  19. SocialSubspecies says:

    Should we teach people to read? The more you learn to read, the more complex the structures get and becomes harder to pronunciate. Let alone other languages. By Tims argument it seems it would be better to not teach reading.

  20. psyflick says:

    you can hear tim likes to watch star treck he is talking about Q. pure fantatsy but cant say he is wrong

  21. guytron says:

    Elijah’s god IS an asshole … not the god I learned about in the Bible =/
    Quantum particles blink in and out of existence all the time according to string theory and hawing radiation IIRC. Energy can convert into matter and matter can be converted to energy because they are manifestations of vibrating strings and membranes. I will admit, string theory does not predict a quantum ham sammich =D

  22. guytron says:

    IIRC : If you do not know about Jesus, you do not go to hell, you go to purgatory if you are a good person.
    Under Islam, every sin and every good dead are put on a scale, and if the good outweighs the sins you go to heaven.
    Hell is for children – Pat Benetar

  23. MasonicPleb says:

    My beliefs can be summed up on the side of a van mural.

  24. Blue442 says:

    God damned, more like “Tim rightfully gets annoyed at two dumbasses who can’t answer fucking questions”

  25. lfraser23 says:

    Quantum mechanics is literally the “random ham sandwich” Tim was talking about.

  26. Junk_Male says:

    I literally couldn’t listen to this episode because of Elijah Schaffer, I only made it 20mins.
    When you have to constantly deflect and defend your position of your “God”, it makes you and your position seem weak…. Which it was

  27. Freedomluvr says:

    Tim always acts like hes just smarter than the others likes hes the almighty knower. Hes a fucking loser.

  28. Sonarv1 says:

    Some criticism.

    Tim’s concept of Gell is directly pulled from Dante’s Inferno.

    The concept that “Science” is used to “prove” things is a falisy. You come up with a “Theory” & you use “Science” to “disprove” that theory.

    Therefore; at a scientific level, we have yet to disprove God. Atheism cannot exist. Not on a scientific level anyway. You are left with those who believe the theory is true & those that do not but cannot prove that it is false.

    Elijah has a very basic understanding of Christianity. Enough for the faithful, but not enough to “teach” or “spread” said faith. He needs to learn & understand the history of Judeo-Christainity as much as the word of God.

    Sydney is lost in her Atheism. She gives it the definition of Agnostism but is determined to be called an Atheist. Agnostics are Atheists awaiting proof that God exists. Proof that can never be found. Not without a very personal spiritual moment in their personal life.

    Ian has the toung of a Serpent. Constantly changing the definition of words to confuse. Ian is a Troll. A bringer of Chaos. Lol

    Now some of my religious truths.
    I practice a form of Judaism. One in which Jesus is the Messiah. The savior of mankind if you will.

    Understanding #1: Judaism is a Polytheistic Religion. Therefore so is Christianity & all it’s offshoots & Islam & its offshoots.

    The very first commandment relays this.

    “Thou shall not hold any other God above me”

    In Hebrew, the Book of Gensis say of the creation of man. The translation gives “I” & “my” where the words used are actually plural. “Elohim” or “Gods”

    When Jerusalem falls to Babylon, God says that he would allow the God of Babylon win & take the people from Israel.

    Very clears that there are other “Gods” & that the Jews believe that their “God” is above all others.

    Hell does not exist. To be in Hell is to be separate from God. To go to Heaven is to be in the presence of God. That’s all. Those who never found God are not “punished”. They just remain outside the presence of God.

    Satan is an adversary of Man. Not God.

    I can go really into depth in all of this & a basic understanding of history that which is behind it.its taken me over 20 years to get to where I am & I’m still learning new things today.

    • guytron says:

      I do not disagree with much of what you posit.
      I am basically agnostic but have read a Couple translations of the Bible and one of the Qu’ran.
      I am not an expert and can not recite much of either but they do not convince me that the God(s) of those religions is benevolent.
      The most interesting thing you posit seems to me to be that their could be many gods responsible for creation of the universe like a group of scientists doing an experiment.
      Tim’s point that the Universe is perfect because the constants do not change is what I think is circumstantial evidence that something very intelligent could be responsible … and Sydney is pretty … that’s all. =)

  29. Bignate says:

    Never seen so many comments on a bonus segment in all of the ones I watched.
    I am a member from before the bonus segment was off and running.
    So, if Tim listened carefully, he did describe and answer the question in a specific way.

  30. ThePinkRangerWasMyFirstCrush says:

    I was looking forward to a good deep conversation. Unfortunately this was just another video of this sort that ended up being people bashing their heads against the wall. No headway and not very constructive.

  31. manistic says:

    Ricky Gervais has it right. Tim was right about Sydney, for what he was trying to get her to acknowledge. But he was wrong in the rest of it and in ignoring her beliefs. It’s possible he just couldn’t see what she was trying to say, which was this “I want to identify as my definition of atheist. ” The argument should have ended there.
    https://youtu.be/–ZAowEq0jg Russell Brand and Ricky Gervais interview, was great. Just like Ricky’s other bit, “You don’t believe in one less god than I do.”

  32. Zack Jordan says:

    I don’t believe in any religion, I believe that a higher power of some sort could exist and created all this, but at the end if the day I believe that people should believe as they want and let others have free will.

  33. UncontestedCHMP says:

    By the time I’ve scrolled down this far, I’ve forgotten her name, but I believe she is an apatheist, as I am myself. Why do humans even ask the question?

  34. madadam1@pipeline.com says:

    Holy shit! God is Roko’s Basilisk! Oops, sorry, now the basilisk sees you!

  35. StevenBellisle says:

    The Christian god is a sadistic sack of shit and Christians are delusional.

  36. IamDanSilver says:

    More like everyone pisses off Tim

  37. ZerioctheTank says:

    So to summarize, or at least dumb it down for people like me you have to have faith. All this talk of electrons, and god speaking to people while on shrooms goes over my head. You have to be willing to blindly trust in your faith. Perhaps some of us aren’t ready for that yet, and there’s no random bible verseor near death experience explanation that will convince someone. Respect where people are in regards to their spiritual beliefs, and if we’re wrong then we’ll spend eternity without God.

  38. NovalisR@nsom says:

    Tim asked good questions, and Elijah didn’t do a good job of answering them. It’s important to point out, though, that Elijah is defending WESTERN Christianity. Eastern Orthodoxy sees it so much differently.

  39. TheSkoalBandit says:

    I mean it says in the Bible, in any version of your choice, heaven and hell is essentially eternal life or eternal death. Heaven and hell as he speaks about it and how Hollywood, in its own understanding, portrays it. This is taken from Revelation. Only in revelation does this account exist as the rest of the old and New Testament does give name for it is just a way of stating eternal death. Your soul and spirit die with the body. 🤷🏻

  40. Wilson52 says:

    Elijah really fuckin bothers me.

  41. LightningKrazo says:

    “That which we have seen and heard we proclaim also to you, so that you too may have fellowship with us; and indeed our fellowship is with the Father and with his Son Jesus Christ.” 1 John 1:3

    We have fellowship with God through faith, as the scriptures say, “For in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith.” Galatians 3:26

    “He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him. And he is before all things, and in him all things hold together.” Colossians 1:15-17

    “And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled only to those who are perishing. In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.” 2 Corinthians 4:3-4

    “For it stands in Scripture: ‘Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone, a cornerstone chosen and precious, and whoever believes in him will not be put to shame.’ So the honor is for you who believe, but for those who do not believe, ‘The stone that the builders rejected has become the cornerstone,’ and ‘A stone of stumbling, and a rock of offense.’ They stumble because they disobey the word, as they were destined to do. But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for his own possession, that you may proclaim the excellencies of him who called you out of darkness into his marvelous light.” (1 Peter 2:6-9)

    “For he says to Moses, ‘I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.’ So then it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy. For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, ‘For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you, and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.’ So then he has mercy on whomever he wills, and he hardens whomever he wills. You will say to me then, ‘Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?’ But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, ‘Why have you made me like this?’ Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory—” (Romans 9:15-23)

    “For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.” (Romans 8:29-30)

    “Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. Through him we have also obtained access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in hope of the glory of God.” Romans 5:1-2

    “who saved us and called us to a holy calling, not because of our works but because of his own purpose and grace, which he gave us in Christ Jesus before the ages began, and which now has been manifested through the appearing of our Savior Christ Jesus, who abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel,” 2 Timothy 1:9-10

    “Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come.” 2 Corinthians 5:17

    “When Christ who is your life appears, then you also will appear with him in glory.” Colossians 3:4

    As the Lord Jesus Christ says,

    “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.” Matthew 5:17

    ***

    “Behold, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah, not like the covenant that I made with their fathers on the day when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, my covenant that they broke, though I was their husband, declares the Lord. But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my law within them, and I will write it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they shall be my people. And no longer shall each one teach his neighbor and each his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they shall all know me, from the least of them to the greatest, declares the Lord. For I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.” Jeremiah 31:31-34 (586-570 BC)

    “And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and pleas for mercy, so that, when they look on me, on him whom they have pierced, they shall mourn for him, as one mourns for an only child, and weep bitterly over him, as one weeps over a firstborn.” Zechariah 12:10 (480-470 B.C.)

    “And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules.” Ezekiel 36:26-27 (590-570 B.C.)

    “so shall my word be that goes out from my mouth; it shall not return to me empty, but it shall accomplish that which I purpose, and shall succeed in the thing for which I sent it.” Isaiah 55:11 (700-681 B.C)

    “Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will not pass away.” Matthew 24:35

  42. Kava76 says:

    Well, I was forced to grow up Catholic and I stopped believing when I was 18. After that, I emancipated and I lived on my own. I used to drive from Mexico to the US on my own at that age, feeling invencible. I was 18 and I tough I was eternal and untouchable. To make the story short, I can attest God saved me from falling off a cliff. He saved me three times from being raped, when I was in the middle of nowhere, without no help available. And I am talking in the middle of the desert in Northern Mexico and Texas, with no people/police around. He has saved me from dying. After the first incident, I tough it was just good luck/coincidence. But then, the cliff came around and God stopped my car 5 feet away from falling off. There’s no chance that was a coincidence. Nobody came to rescue me, but my car just stop working 5 feet away from me falling off that cliff. If that’s not God, I don’t know what else you can call it. But after those horrible experiences, I started believing in God by conviction. Because he showed me his power. And even when I denied him and rejected him out of deception and pain, he came to my rescue. I am a woman who doesn’t belong to any church. But I am a believer. He is with me and he is my lord and savior.

  43. WesternSib says:

    Let Ian talk more.

  44. Wildcard_R says:

    Bummed that so many Christians miss Romans 2 as the answer to Tim’s question, which, I believe, describes CONSCIENCE as the judge when you did not get a formal introduction to ‘The Truth’ or Jesus Christ. I believe Conscience is also what guides you to Christ in the end as well, and that a way to describe a lot of people who think ‘they are good people’ means that they follow the second law of God – Love your neighbor, which means being in appropriate relationship with your neighbor (the first law being to love God, or be in good relationship with him). I find it equally interesting that the First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States is fundamentally a protection of CONSCIENCE. Consider ‘the law’ in the following scriptures as the religious teachings of the Jews and Christians, for I believe the ultimate goal of both Judaism and Christianity is the salvation of those who follow ‘the law’ described in the old and new testaments. But here’s the relevant scripture. Romans 2: 11-16 (NABRE) 11″There is no partiality with God. 12All who sin outside the law will also perish without reference to it, and all who sin under the law will be judged in accordance with it. 13For it is not those who hear the law who are just in the sight of God; rather, those who observed the law will be justified. 14For when the Gentiles who do not have the law by nature observed the prescriptions of the law, they are a law for themselves even though they do not have the law. 15They show that the demands of the law are written in their hears, while their consciuence also bears witness and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even defend them 16 on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge people’s hidden works through Christ Jesus.”

    This fits the parable of the Good Samaritan, who is both hated and unclean to the Jew, but its the dude who follows his conscience to love his neighbor, to do what is right and good, that’s the dude who God loves.

  45. Grimalken says:

    Could it be that god only “reveals himself to you” upon your death, and if you reject him upon your death, that you go to hell. Which means you may not have to find God in life. Hence the good Hindu who never heard of Jesus is not damned to go to hell.

  46. goaldeerocks says:

    If i live my life being as just, fair, and loving as possible, while not pledging allegiance to any singular god, and i go to hell, then i dont want to go to heaven anyways.

    • ZerioctheTank says:

      Same. I being a good and just human being isn’t to warrant me entry, then perhaps a world without God is better. If hell isn’t evil, but an absence of someone that will only accept me unless I mindlessly submit I’ll give that a hard pass.

    • KiahVS says:

      No human deserves hell. I am a Christian who believes in the evil God of the Bible. My views are widely disagreed with.

  47. Elevate77 says:

    Ian is based!

  48. Mrbogus47 says:

    If you think that measuring oxygen and seeing it with your own eyes will help prove that reality is “real. Using matter as a means to prove the existence of matter in a general sense is fallacious.

  49. Mikeneff2 says:

    Elijah is not good at explaining this at all, These questions Tim are asking have answers and Elijah just muddies the waters at every point. So frustrating for a Christian. Elijah says you shouldn’t talk about God cause it might mislead people about his nature then does that to everyone on this show. Clearly he needs to have these conversations more and work on articulating. Cause losing the argument to Tim philosophically he then turns to the “Dont tell God how he should do things” argument… oh my gosh what argument would work less on Tim mother freaking Pool? Dude so bad…

  50. GhostTroll says:

    Tim is a very intelligent man. He sees things in the eyes of an agnostic which in it of itself is the only way to see the world. How can we even fathom what is out there? We are incredibly small compared to the universe.

    Yes Tim comes off as somewhat arrogant 😀 but that is how we perceive highly intelligent people…sometimes.

  51. MMacko86 says:

    Tim, Atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive. Agnosticism has to do with what you know and atheism has to do with what you believe. If you do not believe there is a god you are an atheist, but if you don’t know for sure you are then also agnostic. I am an agnostic atheist. There are also agnostic theists, which are people who don’t know, but feel there is a conscious higher power somewhere out there. It is a misconception that atheism has to do with knowing for sure there is no god. People use it that way from time to time, but that is not what it means.

  52. sartoraaus@gmail.com says:

    Timmy…be nice

  53. Chrisriley94 says:

    I wish Tim would have a member of the church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints in there he’s had a lot of other Christian faiths but that one and I think it would be very interesting to hear what they think about their beliefs

  54. sartoraaus@gmail.com says:

    Believing is “letting go” of hubris

  55. sartoraaus@gmail.com says:

    Why couldn’t a ham sandwich just appear out of nowhere? Isn’t that how the come to exist?

    I’ve not sure I could believe anyone who claimed to know for a fact that on a planet in another galaxy ham sandwiches don’t just appear with the snap of the fingers.

  56. MMacko86 says:

    I used to sound a lot like Elijah, but I am no longer convinced that any god exists. It is less about rejecting him and more about no longer viewing the evidences as valid. Belief is not a choice. You are either convinced of something or you are not. You can fake a belief, but you don’t actually hold to those beliefs.

  57. CanadianMastiff says:

    Interesting. Thank you.

  58. Michael_Ashcroft says:

    Tim, I love the show but you are being a dick. All religions base their credo on being created in their gods image. Not one mentions a transindential computer system. So yeah. Jesus did look like ted Nugent.

  59. YayaMac says:

    Everyone here did a great job defending their position. However, Tim’s clear anger is what the problem was. If I were Elijah, I would have said, “of course someone who never heard of the Word of God can go to Heaven. God is merciful, God is Just.” As a Catholic, I think Elijah missed that point. Tim said in a video he was raised Catholic but his family was “disrespected.” This can only mean that humans, most likely a priest, offended his family in such a way that it was anti-thetical to Christian values. That’s sad. But I feel like Tim, who admits he believes in God, has a negative view towards organized religion, therefore he lets those harsh emotions get a hold of him. What also is missing here is that the very definition of Faith is that there is no scientific explanation. A roomful of highly intelligent people arguing becomes circular. Not necessarily ineffective–a great and important conversation–but, “to one who has faith, no explanation is necessary. To one without faith, no explanation is possible” (Aquinas). Until Ian, Tim, and Sydney experience it themselves, no logic will convince them. I pray they are “convinced” one day. And people like Elijah, in his own failed human nature, will ironically bring them to the Fold.

  60. jaydav04 says:

    This conversation woulda been best done with a priest included. This was basically amateur spirituality hour.

  61. Chazzman22 says:

    elijah definitely lost me after he said he speaks in tongues lol

  62. IanG says:

    Invite Kris Vallotton. He is well versed in politics and a pastor of a controversial large church in Redding California.

  63. TimsBeanie says:

    Really enjoyed this 🙂

  64. Thesirclay says:

    Unfortunately Elijah is not good at explaining the specific points Tim is asking for. He is very passionate and I myself as a Christian was cringing while listening to him try to explain and jumping from separate point to separate point not answering the questions Tim asks.

  65. swampyne127@gmail.com says:

    Tim’s talking about entropy and such but that’s the physical. And not metaphysical

  66. SBHX says:

    Tim, you really need to talk to Chris Langan.

  67. TotalBody says:

    Absolutely brilliant show, probably, if not the best so far. So fascinating to listen to the different views from everyone over such a deep and profound subject.
    I don’t know if i believe and in many ways I do admire people that do, however, what I do know is with conversations and content of this caliber… Timcast will be around for many, many years to come.

  68. alexthaalien says:

    Loved the show. Elijah is clearly passionate but doesn’t express his thoughts very well & Tim definitely takes advantage of that in this episode. Sydney’s argument for Athiesm was basically, “i don’t believe it because i don’t understand it” & it’s very simple.

    Ian and Lydia continue to be perfect

  69. tomvvhite says:

    Elijah should’ve taken it back to Adam and Eve and the original sin. That’s basically what sets the groundwork for all of mankind requiring redemption regardless of where and when they were born

  70. solidhalon says:

    Perfection, Tim, doesn’t require change or adaptation.

  71. Eric_Worsfold1 says:

    Not encouraging the use of the psychedelics but I’m pretty sure I met god on a really high dose acid trip.

  72. solidhalon says:

    Not knowing the law doesn’t exempt you from it.

  73. epizzle75 says:

    Tim’s worship of this ham sandwich is tedious. All jokes aside the conversation won’t make any progress because no one went in seeking to learn something but to prove their own agenda/belief.

  74. aznkodiak says:

    all the questions Tim poses has been answered by great thinkers of the past. there is a deep rabbit hole that takes literally years to come to the end of… start with C.S. Lewis and go backwards to G.K Chesterton and then to Cornillis Van Till… and so on and so on

  75. darknight118 says:

    This is one of those shows that I want to sit down and join the discussion sooo bad .. lol

  76. Fifth says:

    Tim is by far the smartest person in the room and, quite obviously talks less BS than others. Because he’s smart he has discovered the simple truth – religious texts are simplified versions of the THING they’re trying to communicate. He can see how simplistic they are, all of them, and therefore assumes they must be all wrong. That’s the logic that leads him to the Einstein’s God.

    There’s a logical error in this, if something is overly simplistic it doesn’t necessarily mean it must be wrong. There’s other possibility, that it was made simple for a reason. Two reasons, actually.
    – First, the creatures who created religious texts are humans. Even if you assume divine inspiration, we as human beings are so limited in our computing capability that we simply can’t comprehend anything but relatively low level, simple concepts. God can miraculously transfer the perfect understanding directly into our brain, we wouldn’t understand it anyway. Thus, it’s inevitably simplistic. That’s where Tim really shines, he’s smart enough to realize how stupid we, humans are and therefore should have some humility before the Infinity.
    – Second, people with extremely high IQ like Tim are rare, most of the human race are little better than chickens. There’s literally no use in creating a guidebook that almost nobody would be able to understand. That would be harsh and heartless, if you believe that all human beings have intrinsic worth, despite their IQ level. And most religions believe that, not only Judaism and Christianity.

  77. pkrismanits says:

    I like Elijah but he did a piss poor job of answering Tim. Tim was also extremely unfair, not really listening (showing that Tim has his own bent already and isn’t very open in this area).

    Tim you should invite someone like Harold Eberle or Jonathan Welton if you want good answers to your questions. Even I could do better on this than Elijah.

  78. philchoart says:

    Tim is an asshole, but he makes pretty good points. I’m convinced people don’t know anything, they just believe things.

  79. Mechanic says:

    Frustrating conversation at points but it really got me when Tim straight up made Mac’s argument from It’s Always Sunny. Stupid science bitches!

  80. Bryan_Liem says:

    J.R.R. Tolkien has an excellent Middle Earth parallel story of why God created angels and us, why free will requires and risks the ability to rebel against God or stay truly in loyal and loving God, and how the whole thing went bad in Heaven. It parallels the Bible at many points, though Tolkien uses Middle Earth names. It is the first chapter of his posthumous book, The Silmarillion. I love how this Middle Earth heaven is full of singing and praising God until Satan with freewill decides he should replace God. As if that were possible, only in his freewill mind. Satan introduces a corrupt melody, some angels sing along, and off they go. Most of the chapter is great, until it stops paralleling the Bible. When they introduce the giant spider, the parallels have already stopped.

  81. Bryan_Liem says:

    In the Bible book of Romans 1:18-25, it explains that people can realize God through the simple fact of all creation, the complex world that we live in was created by God. But remember it is now a fallen, tainted creation due to Adam & Eve. Realizing God through creation could be tainted by our selfish fallen nature, we could miss realizing God and instead create a false god to worship instead. This is why it is better to have the Gospel preached to the ignorant. God sends some guidance if you are willing.

  82. Bryan_Liem says:

    https://www.gty.org/library/sermons-library/1290/a-jet-tour-through-revelation
    This is the best overview of the Book of Revelation that I have come across in 20 years of being a Christian Bible Believer. Pastor John MacArthur, in California, hits all the major points in about an hour, and he seems reasonable, not too complicated, to the point, as correct as can be with so much symbolism in the Book of Revelation.

  83. Zaktak says:

    Universe. Break that word down. One verse. Let there be light.

  84. NeightDee says:

    Elijah is a nut job. Hell is inside the earth…. Also he thinks you go to hell if you don’t love god a thing that never shows him self to you but if you don’t love him you go to hell? Dude fuck you. Nut job.

  85. FxTwT says:

    Actually the Bible says that those who have never heard of God are without excuse because evidence of His existence is in creation. Even as a child, we go outside and look at the trees and touch grass, and we see the order of nature and the universe, just like Tim said when discussing the “code of the universe being perfect”.

    And for someone who hasn’t heard the gospel, belief in a God is all it takes, the same way Abraham never trusted (or heard of) Christ but he still trusted God.

    Those who learn the Bible are tasked with preaching and teaching others in truth, and if you use it for your own gain *cough* Catholics, baptists, Mormons, etc., then you are going to be held accountable for adding and taking away from the Bible.

    That’s why I am nondenominational and am highly skeptical of many religious institutions.

  86. Stephan says:

    30 min in and Elijah can’t answer a 100 percent perfectly reasonable answer and its really sad that no one here can acknowledge that because they are so dedicated to their cult. This is why so many moderates who may agree with you on EVERY issue but religious ones would rather vote against you. I have lost respect for Elijah and and anyone supporting him. Hell, I’d rather support Biden and the progressives. This cult shit has got to stop.

    • Stephan says:

      Wow just got past the 30 min mark and listened to Sydney for 15 min and my respect for her skyrocketed. She is one of the few people I’ve ever heard use atheist and agnostic right and can call both Tim and Elijah out on their bullshit.

    • Stephan says:

      AGNOSTICS AND ATHEIST are NOT EXCLUSIVE! Most agnostics are still atheist. FUCK!

  87. Benjamin0177 says:

    anyone else have to disable their VPN for these videos to work?

  88. Daniy says:

    Here’s my testimony and why I know God is real.
    I grew up in a pentecostal family. When I was a kid I really wanted a parrot. So I asked my mom for a parrot. My mom told me, if you want a parrot ask God and he will give you one. So me being a kid I fully believed it 100% without a doubt, stood next to the window and said a small prayer. Asked God to give me a parrot.
    Later that day, we get a phone call from my brother who used to work for a school bus company and on weekends he would sometimes drive the church bus for youth events. They went to the mountains and while he was in the bus waiting on the youth snowboarding and skiing, he spotted a cold parakeet on a branch and he went and literally picked him up with his hands, it was too cold to fly away I guess? And the first thing he does is call us and asks to talk to me if I want it. Obviously i said yes and he brought it home to me.

    Now, the odds of a parrot being up in a snow covered mountain are slim to none. Then add the odds of him being there that day when he did this maybe once a month? Then add the fact that I prayed and asked for one on top of that!!!! That is statistically impossible.

    So from that day on, that’s my proof that God is real. And that if you ask and have complete and total faith, you shall get it. Have zero doubt!! Jesus was able to walk on water because he had zero doubt.

    • chillywe86 says:

      Jesus was able to walk on the water because He is God! He is the Creator of everything (see the first chapter of the Gospel of John) – including nature, science, the laws of physics, et al – therefore, He is above and outside of those natural laws. Peter also walked on the water – but only for as long as he kept his eyes focused on Jesus. Once he looked away, he fell into the water. Jesus used that as a learning experience for Peter – and for the rest of us!
      I loved your parrot story. However, to base your belief in God solely on what you can “get” from Him…well, it reduces God to the equivalent of a convenience store. Have you ever prayed for something, but then didn’t get it? If God is only a genie in a bottle to you, then how much value does He have when He doesn’t produce for you? Having this kind of a view of God does a disservice to Him – and it keeps your faith at a shallow level.
      Have you ever prayed for someone you love who is ill to get better – but they didn’t? People pray all of the time for healing, either for themselves or for others. Does God answer those prayers? Of course He does! But the problem isn’t God not answering our prayers; the problem is that our perspective is different than God’s. We pray for healing and sometimes, that healing is something that we can see and/or experience. But sometimes, that healing comes in a form that we weren’t necessarily thinking of…as in, eternal healing.
      My cousin – whom I loved very much – died last week from brain cancer. We prayed for God to heal her. You know what? He has! Her healing is complete, perfect, and eternal. She is fine now. Selfishly, though, we would have rather her healing had happened here, physically. But even if God had miraculously zapped that horrible, insidious brain tumor into nonexistence – she still would have to die someday. (Jesus raised Lazarus from the dead, but poor Lazarus still had to die – again.) Now though, she has completed her course…finished her race…and she has heard Jesus say to her, “Well done, good and faithful servant!” And the faith that we have in Jesus gives us hope that we will see her, and our other loved ones, again someday. That is called “blessed assurance!”
      “Now faith is the substance (assurance) of things hoped for, the evidence (conviction) of things not seen.” – Hebrews 11:1 God bless you, Danny!

    • Kava76 says:

      Well, I was forced to grow up Catholic and I stopped believing when I was 18. After that, I emancipated and I lived on my own. I used to drive from Mexico to the US on my own at that age, feeling invencible. I was 18 and I tough I was eternal and untouchable. To make the story short, I can attest God saved me from falling off a cliff. He saved me three times from being raped, when I was in the middle of nowhere, without no help available. And I am talking in the middle of the desert, with no people/police around. He has saved me from dying. After the first incident, I tough it was just good luck/coincidence. But then, the cliff came around and God stopped my car 5 feet away from falling off. There’s no chance that was a coincidence. Nobody came to rescue me, but my car just stop working 5 feet away from me falling off that cliff. If that’s not God, I don’t know what else you can call it. But after those horrible experiences, I started believing in God by conviction. Because he showed me his power. And even when I denied him and rejected him out of deception and pain, he came to my rescue. I am a woman who doesn’t belong to any church. But I am a believer. He is with me and he is my lord and savior.

  89. Biased_Confirmations says:

    I really wish i could talk to Tim (maybe syd too but she is further away and argues in bad faith) about this as I came from his position not long ago (mere months) and now i am on the path/a believer. (Spirituality/faith is personal our own journey to experience) Almost everything elijah said is right but he is too inside baseball for somebody that doesn’t understand the trinity. This idea that “christian god” is something…. No, God is God no matter your language, or understanding. Jesus is Jesus, and almost all faiths have the Jesus. Don’t get bogged down in the semantics or technicalities. The word is what matters:

    The Christians have found the trinity, which is the full story: the higher power that we can never prove, the literal life that we live and is all proof, and the special connection between the two that will humble you as nothing else can… (once your understand the true meaning and accept Christ) God is the higher power. (It’s easy for anybody that is very smart to get that there must be a higher power) The holy spirit is our third of the equation, the totality & collective goodwill, faith, and positivity of Man. The hardest part to believe is Jesus… Jesus represents the link between man and God. He is the bridge that connects us to the higher power. God is everything and created Jesus as a connection for us actually be able to understand and humble ourselves with all the technology and evil that surrounds us. To accept Jesus we must admit that we are not the main character of the story and that we must humble ourselves to admit that our purpose here is to spread the word of Jesus and to produce Good God fearing humble people that are on the path. (Starting with ourselves, then our children, and then others) that is our our purpose on this planet, and our duty to those that are confused… That hold themselves as the connection to God or worship something else as the higher power… Faith is admitting that Jesus is the one and only true savior and reason we are here. We do not connect to God ourselves as He is the only path to God’s true embrace. Until you accept this, you will not be humble enough to be in God’s embrace and will not be whole. (Like Elijah and I are now)

    No matter how smart and successful you are, you will have a hole in your heart that nothing else will fill. Thus, Hell is being out of the embrace of God, and being out of his embrace for eternity is the cruelest torment we can allow for others Tim. This is why we must spread the word. Until Tim and Sydney take that step, humble themselves, accept their role and jesus into their heart, they will continue to be tormented by such simple ideas and basic ideas.

    Only you can accept God and Jesus and humble yourself to have faith and accept the Trinity.

    <3 you will all get there once you are ready.

  90. Bosco912 says:

    Guys, guys…nobody here knows the subject matter even remotely well enough to explain any of this. And Schaffer should heed his own words—that the people who presume to teach the bible would be judged by God most harshly.

  91. Caligulove says:

    Jesus tapdancing Christ on a tricycle…

    This conversation was just Elijah being *really* loud and misunderstanding what “atheism” is. It is just the lack of a belief in a god. Most people who are atheists are agnostic atheists. They don’t buy the claim that there is a god but they don’t know for sure. Jeez.

    • svin83 says:

      She hates these conversations because they make her think?

      • rancidl says:

        EXACTLY. I know other athiests and AU athiests and they LITERALLY throw up in their mouth when they hear the word God. If asked about higher power long enough, they think about it and do believe in a higher authority when asked… so why label yourself athiest? Why revolt at the term God? It makes no sense and they’re doing the work of the devil. It’s as if their higher authority is what they THINK is logic but is actually their mind not being their own. Once you point this out to them in a conversation, the cognitive dissonance makes them change topics immediately.

  92. Dwayne865 says:

    I love the fact they talk about this stuff, but it is painful. They are just not knowledgeable enough about this stuff. They need to get on someone like Dinesh D’Souza or John Lennox. Maybe I’m dreaming but it would be nice!

  93. Edrification says:

    It’s more like this: You are standing at the trailhead preparing to walk the path, and you are told that God is there and offers to walk with you and guide you. Even if you walk without him, and think you are alone, he is there, ready to guide you. At any time, you may ask for him, and he is there. You may reject him, and ask for him repeatedly, and out of love he will oblige.

    If you ask for him, you acknowledge him as God. Therefore, if you reject him, you do so knowing he is God. It is the rejection that will leave you at the end of the path alone, and at the mercy of a place without him.

    If no one tells you that he is there, it doesn’t matter. He is still there. You walk the path and enjoy his splendor, ignorant of him who created it, but coming to know him through his creation, and never rejecting him.

    It is the rejection, not the ignorance, that condemns you to a life without him. At least for a time, a time until God defeats him below.

  94. McCaffrey6100 says:

    When asked what I believe, I simply ask “how is life created from nothing?” Until someone can answer that question I will continue to believe there is a God.

    Then I defer to the oldest books and institutions of Christianity.

  95. roflo1804 says:

    Elijah just explained a very pragmatic belief in God that is reasonable and fair. I left Catholicism when I was a teen and never went back because no one ever gave me an answer that reconciles my doubts in the certainty of scripture with empiricism and the possibility of being seeded by ET’s.

  96. BlazeCast says:

    Be a good person and you know me and my kingdom will be yours. – Christ (summarized to answer Tim’s ego trip)

    • BlazeCast says:

      People like Tim are the ones who experimented on babies, blacks, jews, asians prisoners, animals, etc. They just HAD to expirement to test a theory or belief. Tim is the closest to a WW2 loser than anyone else in that studio.

  97. MiiLikesYoshi says:

    Just want to say: The Bible says “the heavens declare the glory of God”. Literally implying that creation is so complex and amazing that you know it was created by something. Like Tim says: He knows there’s a God because of creation. And every human has this innate knowledge whether they would like to admit it or not. So, even if Tim had never heard of God outside of just observing his surroundings, he would be damned to hell because in his heart he knows that God exists. He looks at creation and says “it’s too perfect to not be created by someone”, but doesn’t seek God any further. Hence the act of rejection Elijah was talking about.

  98. Odal190 says:

    I agree with Tim that she’s not an Atheist, but boy the semantics talk on this gets old really quick. Should not have focused on that, imo.

    Also, no, Mormons don’t have your answer about Christianity because they’re not a denomination of Christianity. Joseph Smith made it clear that he thought of it as the true Christianity as the old Christianity is now made obsolete. The efforts to normalize it as another Christian denomination is disingenuous.

    • Odal190 says:

      Probably “obsolete” is not the correct word, but rather “less complete” would be more accurate. But no edit button, rip. Not too hard to find the info out there on the web though.

  99. C Keeper87 says:

    Damnation is only God’s prerogative. This is something I take issue with in conversation and listening to Born again Christians, that do xyz or go to hell. This is why, even the Catholic Church doesn’t “Damn” anyone, and we’re Even called by the Church to pray for the souls of those excommunicated, i.e. “kicked out of the body of Christ on earth” for at that point the Church recognizes that it is not able to help “save” the souls of the excommunicated. The Catholic Church takes the final stance that every human has the potential to go to heaven, no matter the life they lived, although living certain ways is believed to make it more “unclear” to man whether a person is likely to go to heaven. We’reeven called to pray for the dead, that Gid may take mercy on their souls and show them grace, accepting them into heaven. Christ said only God knows a man’s heart, which is why he mentioned that only God has the authority to judge a man’s soul. We are to always move towards living a holy life, based on the teachings of the Torah (more than today’s Torah) and the New Testament.

    The Catechism of The Catholic Church (CCC) States in exactitude what the beliefs of the Church is, and what the doctrine of the Church is. If you ever wonder what the first Christian Church ever to exist believes, just read that text. It has evolved over time, but many parts are unchanged since the first Catechism, and those things are made clear in the CCC.

    • preengaged says:

      > If you ever wonder what the first Christian Church ever to exist believes, just read…

      … the Bible… which is different than Catholic tradition and creed. Caveat emptor.

  100. Juicepeezy says:

    Well I’ll never get that hour back

  101. Smoke says:

    i think religion is just a means to control people if gods real he should just make himself known instead of playing games with people

    • MiiLikesYoshi says:

      But if that were the case, then how would explain the multiple countries throughout history, including the present time, that murder Christians for their beliefs, but are totally fine with Islamic, Buddhist, etc? How do you explain that meeting in church is banned as part of a lock down, but meeting at Walmart or McDonald’s okay?

      I have no doubt that a portion of, if not most, religions were created to control people. But Christianity is so much more hated among the world.

  102. hcmauve@hotmail.com says:

    I’ve become much more tolerant towards religious people in the last few years but damn is it still obnoxious to hear people preach.
    i’ll live my life as best i can, being as good as i can be and if thats not enough for big G at the end because i didn’t “believe” then fuck him.

    Isn’t trying to explain how god thinks or act some kind of heresy anyway?
    Its all so pointless.

    • DBurleson says:

      Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.

  103. rangspen says:

    I like Elijah, but man, people like him is why I cannot stand born again Christians. There is only one true gospel and he doesn’t have it.

  104. Insamnity says:

    in my opinion the easiest way to explain about being apart of something bigger and stuff going on around us we cant see.

    Sausage party. The dude smoking bath salts. It’s all about frequencies so it seems.

  105. AlexMichaelGabriel says:

    To imagine the unimaginable is impossible and that is what’s possible.

    Unfathomable – incapable of being fully explored or understood.
    Incomprehensible – not able to be understood.
    Unimaginable – difficult or impossible to imagine or comprehend.

  106. MissMary says:

    Gotta love people arguing about an omnipotent being and what “it” says/ wants according to a book completely written by HUMANS. Which are fallible. Is there God? probably imo. But you want to try and convince me that god of the Bible is what “God” really is? I would call you mislead. period. No person on earth understands god or can claim to know what god wants or is. period. Did god personally hand you a note? no? ok then. If god wanted us to all understand the SAME THING then god would be able to do so with one snap of his / it’s fingers. If god has fingers. which I suppose god can have fingers if he wants fingers. But you get what I’m saying. WE KNOW NOTHING. PERIOD. You just have to follow your heart as to what you feel is true. Don’t judge others. Don’t tell them they “going to hell”. YOU don’t know. Maybe THIS is hell? YOU don’t know. Believe what you want. Just be a nice human. MMm k?

  107. Latterdaygamers says:

    Just a couple of spiteful mutants auguring with a real human.

  108. UppityG says:

    Fuck. The moderation bot kicked on again. Will someone please post what we should not do in order to avoid moderation. If it is more than ONE live link, fine, please just say so.

    Pool, you still favor using your intellect to handle the world and how you understand God. Let’s stipulate the senses that humans possess, as we know them to date:

    hxxps: // www . considerable . com / health / healthy-living/humans-five-senses/

    Some of the senses are voluntary and involuntary, most are involuntary. Regardless, these are what we use to intake information for our survival. We also use some of them to detect more than the obviously detectable. Some humans use certain senses in novel ways so as to do so. That is a convo for another day.

    Moving on to determining for oneself if God exists.

    Pool, while Schaffer was explaining the Christian grasp of believing in God, which made sense to me, but seemed to fail to reach you, ultimately you have to set for you the criteria that must be satisfied so that you may come closer to feeling God in your life. It is an intellectual exercise for you to question how that is attained by someone else. That is a form of being judgmental.

    Watson has elected atheism as her spiritual tenet. Insisting that she isn’t an atheist because she allows that there’s a 1% exception to her belief policy is, to use a term, puritanical.

    You do something that tends to slow the pace of the podcast. When the convo reaches a point that presents an interesting pivot for you, you will do this: you turn to the guest and pose this kind of question: do you know what this principle of physics is? And you do this to all your guests. Unless the guest has studied physics likely they’ll either make a stab at it or they’ll answer “No, I don’t know.” They end up feeling put on the spot and exhibit concern that you’re trying to make them sound stupid. I don’t think that’s your intention. I believe you’re trying to transition via the pivot but you transmit that intention poorly. You end up sounding a like a guy who poses a completely random questions pulled from the sky and your friend has no way of having a ghost of a chance to luck into knowing the answer. Had he known, he’d’ve studied up just out of self-defense.

    As far as I’m concerned — speaking from my perspective, ok? — evidence of God is everywhere. A tree is one of the most inspirational cathedrals at which to converse with God. We are not perfect, that is why you cannot determine that the universe is perfect. I’ll wrap up with this question regarding your example of proof that the universe is perfect is that a hamburger does not randomly appear in mid-air. You go on to mention how such a thing can and has happened in a video game you were creating and figured out it was a bit of code. Here’s another possibility for you to consider: the bit flip.

    Enjoy this clip from Veritaseum exploring the phenomenon:
    hxxps: // www . youtube . com / watch?v=AaZ_RSt0KP8

    • UppityG says:

      Oh, re the Old Man in the Cloud depiction of God.

      That was how artists of many moon ago chose to depict Him in their paintings and it comforted people, so it was duplicated for many generations without controversy in most common company. It wasn’t until communism started having more influence over the public square by asking disingenuous questions of young people without Critical Thinking, that the idea of questioning existing norms, customs, religious practices was not only not taboo, but should be done and continued until they were all erased or coopted. Everything had to rebelled against, including the innocent depictions of God.

      God is depicted in many different ways around the world. My contention is that God does exist and all those depictions, the result of the wide variety of how populations believe in God, are simply their way of visualizing what is one God. Each of us uses images of God that comfort us in some way.

      For all we know, God does look like that, ha ha, the jokes on us.

      Also: Crossland is an attention hog. He continues to be a net net loss. He is willing to accommodate evil ideas but holds the idea of God in open contempt. As I’ve long said, he hurts the show.

  109. Mcstarcher says:

    Wow, this debate got esoteric and almost hostile at points. Yet for all the circular logic, dead end arguments and unanswerable questions it was a nice break from politics. Thankyou for reminding us what really matters, the condition and nature of the human soul.
    CHEERS!

  110. roscoe_buster@yahoo.com says:

    Is Ian’s whole purpose on this show to say random stuff and make us think WTF is wrong with this guy…. lol

  111. PolishPierogi says:

    Go to Church Tim.

  112. fuyu says:

    Oh my gosh I usually love these talks but Tim was nails on a chalkboard in this bonus episode… Elijah and Sydney were easy to listen to but Tim.. uggghh…. I felt just as frustrated as Sydney here and I’m a religious person.

  113. NephroRock says:

    These guys should check out what CHUCK MISSLER has to say about “the end times”. It’s very interesting!

  114. JonahGrimm says:

    Please get Michael Knowles back on, or Seamus, or Jack Poso. There are answers to your questions, Tim. Elijah unfortunately didn’t have them on him.

  115. Forgecore says:

    The idea of those who have not received instruction on the gospel being judged differently is like this. You will/they did encounter God, a person who would have accepted it if he had been preached to would have exhibited the foundation stones of the gospel in ways less specifically informed and more representative of that point in the unfolding story the lord has been telling from the beginning of the creation.

  116. NERV-doc says:

    Everyone in the room has a fundamental misunderstanding of the terms “Atheist” and “Agnostic”. The two are not mutually exclusive. Atheism is the rejection of a positive claim that many people make, which is that God exists and they know what he wants for you, whereas Agnosticism is a claim of knowledge. Gnostic means “to claim to know” so agnostic would then mean “not claiming to know”. Most atheists are agnostic as well because they don’t claim to know whether or not there is one or any gods but aren’t convinced of the ones people do claim are real. This misunderstanding is painfully common in most people because they never looked deeply into any one religion or theism in general.

  117. jcarroll1214 says:

    First, I don’t want to scroll to the bottom of the page to leave comment 🙂 Second, I love these conversations. Have on Steve Deace if you could. Really awesome guy on theology and political analysis

  118. Digsbone says:

    This is pure gold!!!

  119. Tpaul says:

    Tim, I truly hope you get to read this important message. The truth is that “religion” and “Christians” have been lying about the Bible for centuries. When I first learned what I’m about to share with you, I asked my pastor if he knew these things, and he responded “Yes, I know that’s what the Bible actually says, but these people in my church don’t read the Bible so I can’t teach that.” I never returned to that church ever again, and these are the things I’ve learned by actually reading the Bible. To start, the Bible doesn’t say ANYWHERE that when we die we either go to heaven or hell. It’s not in the Bible. In fact, Jesus himself said no man has been to heaven except for he who came from heaven (John 3:13). This means that the only man who ever walked this earth who has been to Heaven is Jesus himself. There is a lot more that I will get into on this, but first it’s important to address the lie. The fact is that life after death is a lie. It’s the same lie that the serpent told Eve in the garden. When God created Adam and Eve in the garden, he intended them to live forever. He created them to live forever on Earth and their task was to fill the earth and to multiply. God told Adam that he could eat from every tree in the garden except for the tree of knowledge of good and evil. “For on the day you eat of it, you will certainly die.” (Genesis 2:17). It was the serpent who lied to Adam and said, you will not die, you’ll become just like God….this is the same lie that churches teach today. They say that when we die, we don’t actually die, but we go on living in heaven or hell. It’s not true. The Bible says that the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23). So someone is wrong: either God is wrong when he says we will certainly die, or the people teaching life after death are wrong….Spoiler, God is the one telling the truth…The truth is that he never meant for man to live in heaven. When he created Adam he could have created him in heaven if that’s where God wanted him. After all, God had already created countless angels at that point. Instead, God intended Adam and all of his descendants to live on earth forever, and even though sin entered the world and disrupted that plan, it’s still God’s plan for man to live on earth in peace for all eternity. This is why the Bible talks about a new heaven and a new earth. This is why the Bible teaches about resurrection. There is so much to know and to learn that it is impossible for me to explain it all in one comment, but I implore you, and anyone reading this, to look into this yourself. And the beautiful thing about the resurrection is that the Bible says there is going to be a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous (acts 24:15). Meaning that instead of being damned to an eternal hell as the churches teach, the Bible actually teaches that most people will be given the chance to accept an eternal life on a peaceful earth under God’s rulership. Think about a few things, God is Just, right? Well is it just to condemn a person to an eternity of torment if that person only lived for 70 years? No. Even if that person was evil for 70 years, at most they should be condemned to is a 70 year punishment. But God is even more beautiful than that. Because he will not condemn anyone to an eternity of torture. Here’s another question, in Leviticus 18:31 God forbade the Israelites from making their sons and daughters pass through fire. He expressed how angry it made him. If he was angry that they made their children burn in fire for just a moment, why would God make his children go to a place of fire and torture for all eternity? It just doesn’t make sense. And it’s because the Bible doesn’t teach that anywhere. What the Bible actually teaches is that when we die, we cease to exist. But some day in the near future, God will return the earth to a paradise, and resurrect those who have “fallen asleep in death” and give them a chance at everlasting life on earth….I was going to end it there, but this just sparked one more thought. Remember when Jesus’ friend Lazarus died, and Jesus was moved to tears? Jesus said that Lazarus had “fallen asleep in death.” (John 11:11) Here Jesus compares death to being asleep. A state of unconsciousness. But let’s take it a step farther. Jesus actually resurrects Lazarus. Now if Lazarus was worthy as being counted as one of Jesus’s friends then surely when he died he would have gone to heaven? Then why did Jesus resurrection him? That seems kind of cruel that Jesus would remove him from heaven just to make Lazarus live on earth again just to die all over again. It’s simple. Lazarus wasn’t in heaven. Because when we die we don’t go to heaven. Instead, like Jesus said, we fall asleep in death.

    • preengaged says:

      Revelation 6:9-11 (ESV) — When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne. They cried out with a loud voice, “O Sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long before you will judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” Then they were each given a white robe and told to rest a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and their brothers should be complete, who were to be killed as they themselves had been.

      • Tpaul says:

        I didn’t bring it up because it’s a much deeper conversation which would require a thorough study of scripture, but yes, there are some who go to Heaven. But it’s a very small number of people. And like the scripture you just quoted says, there is a limit to that number. In fact, Revelation reveals the number of people who go to Heaven: 144,000. (Revelation 7). The vast, vast majority of people will not go to Heaven. Instead, their reward/opportunity is to be resurrected to everlasting life on earth. This resurrection promise at the end of days is repeated many times in scriptures (John 11:24) is one example, as well as the promise given to Daniel: “You will rest, but you will stand up for your lot at the end of days.” (daniel 12:13). And consider the promise given at Psalm 37:29: The righteous will inherit the earth, and live forever upon it.

  120. Chrisvrba says:

    Maybe this has been said before but I don’t agree with the aspect that if you never knew God you are damned to hell. This is stated when they said “you are judged on what you know.” If I do not know of God, how can I be judged as if I did? You can’t, however that doesn’t mean there were no morals, no self evident truths of good and evil. I believe it was Jordan peterson who said we only know what evil is because we know what would hurt ourselves. When then understand the pain we cause to others as we do it thus we know it’s bad or evil. Point being if you don’t know of God and will never know of him but you are kind honest and all around a good person heaven is still your reward. On the flip side, if you know God and you reject him, or “accept” him, yet you are still cruel, hurtful, and untrustworthy you are damned to hell.

  121. Nerzana says:

    Tim you should have an actual theologian on that can answer these with the appropriate knowledge.

  122. electronicosmosis says:

    This has been my favorite episode, and also one of the most frustrating to listen to. 😫

    Elijah’s profession of the existence of “Free Will” is, I believe, what is short-circuiting his argument and, whether he recognizes it or not, his logic. This is what Tim was looking for, and I GET it. As I listen to Elijah, I can’t help but hear the sort of rudderless American Evangelical Nondenominational Christianity that has essentially thrown the baby out with the bathwater. It therefore loses the argument far too often by being a mile wide and an inch deep, rather than the alternative.

    Martin Luther posited that the only Being in existence with true Free Will is God Himself. Every great Truth in Scripture (and in good philosophy) exists in tension between verses that simultaneously claim definitively the existence of seemingly opposing Truths (Divine Sovereignty vs. Free Will, Imminence vs. Transcendence, etc.). Nevertheless, this is what one should expect from a Mind as absurdly Higher than our own, and it’s the task of Theology and Philosophy to decipher and explain how both might be true at once. These are the type of questions Tim has, and while Elijah undoubtedly has the desire and intent to communicate the Gospel, I suspect he simply lacks the skills. This is good news for him, though, because skills can be learned.

    I also wish Elijah would’ve just said “people go to hell because they’re evil.” This is another problem modern American Christianity has, because by avoiding calling a spade a spade, they cut the legs out of their own argument. People are evil. Scripture says why. That discussion would have been far more fruitful and philosophically rewarding. One thing nobody brought up is that the word “Gospel” is supposed to indicate “good news.” Why is the Gospel ‘good news’ if people are not evil and in need of redemption, which God then freely chooses to offer to some, for His own reasons?

    Reasons not limited to the simplistic logical arguments of the average American – such as God creating humanity in His own image Because He Chose To. Tim has logical (and great!) questions about Divine Judgment, the existence of evil, and the definition of sin. One idea that’s helped me to wrap my mind around such things is the thought that God (like all of us) is a Being (an impossibly big, complex, and transcendent Mind, but let’s use the word Being nonetheless) with what we could describe as Attributes: qualities that make up the God-ness of God. Some of these attributes can be seen without assistance – His Love, Peace, Power. But some attributes, such as Forgiveness, Grace, Justice, cannot be seen, or even expressed, without the existence of another Being who NEEDS or REQUIRES forgiveness or grace. Perhaps God is creating the ONLY circumstances under which we could ever know Him fully. Perhaps He allowed the existence of sin and evil to provide a ‘backdrop’ against which we could see ALL of His attributes. 🤔🤔

    Like Tim pointed out, the wise man knows that he knows nothing. I’m not claiming to have a definitive answer – but people like myself, and Tim, and probably Sydney, require… BETTER answers. Deeper ones; answers that address The Real Issue rather than quick soundbites for people who believe everything they hear on CNN. This is why I pay for a membership to Timcast.

    Tim, I’m nobody special, just a self-educated Bible believing former Catholic who now worships the Messiah on Saturdays with Jewish folks, but again, feel free to have me on someday!! Love y’all. 😆

    • WesternSib says:

      Weird how I just scrolled through most of the comments and lighted on yours. I think you make so many good points re Luther, conflicting ideas that need to be held at the same time and leaving it to theologians and philosophers to make that make sense. I completely agree.

      Me, I believe that belief is easy but faith is hard. I am a cradle Catholic, still going to mass, but definitely looking for answers that mass doesn’t always answer. Or maybe it does, but I don’t recognize them?

      And I agree that Elijah didn’t do a great job of promoting his view because he kept going back to “accepting God” or “rejecting God.” I also think that the language of churchy people also muddies the waters. Speaking of “God the Father” does sort of instill the image Sydney was talking about, which I wouldn’t believe in either.

      Fact is, I think Elijah left one component out, and that explains why you can’t just say “evil people go to hell.” What makes one evil? Well, if you subscribe to the belief that we are created in God’s image, then that would mean we can create, we have free will, and we are relational beings. This last always seems to get left out of most of these discussions I have listened to. If God created us to have a relationship with Him/Her/The Universe, then we must be relational with each other as well. I think if a person is “evil,” then they have rejected all three: they create destruction instead of building to be better, they choose things that lead to destruction instead of creation, and they have no empathy/are not relational to their fellow humans.

      I did think the quantum physics discussion added a lot. I wish Tim would let Ian talk more!

      When I was about ready to leave the Catholic church about 20 years ago, two things happened in the same 24-hour period. First, I was watching Star Trek: The Next Generation, and I was introduced to Q. Talk about how a human might conceive of God! this guy just showed up on the Enterprise, like he was walking through a door no one could see. Made me think about moving through dimensions (I have a math degree – if you ever have ever read Flatland, you will understand). Then the next day I talked with a theology teacher (I taught in a Catholic high school then) who told me that in the gospel of John – you know, “In the beginning there was the Word, and the Word…” – the original Greek was “logos” for “Word.” Talk about a really lame translation! Logos is the root of logic, so I understood it to mean, basically, the order of the universe (Tim’s code if you will). So, “In the beginning was the order from chaos” was my rough translation.

      So thank you for your comment.

  123. Dcook92 says:

    Honestly I liked watching Timcast but Tim is unreasonable to talk with and thinks he’s smarter than God – while he doesn’t even understand the big picture of the Bible and who Yahweh really is.

    My wallet is telling me it wants out

  124. Charlie says:

    This is basically a bunch of duped people ganging up on the one that hasn’t been.

  125. Numami says:

    No idea if anyone will see this, but pretty sure mormons believe that people who NEVER heard the word of God, when they die, their good and bad will be weighed out and if their good wins they get to go to heaven.

  126. MeOnPlanB says:

    Tim,

    As a man that values learning and logic, I speak to you as a brother.

    Paul makes the same argument you do, that Creation provides the evidence of the Creator. James says, if you lack Wisdom, ask God for it and He will provide it without finding fault.

    You acknowledge that Creation is beyond Man’s understanding. Therefore, its safe to assume the Creator is greater than Creation. You ask a finite and flawed man to explain an Infinite Creator, then you wonder why his answers are insufficient. Where is the logic there?

    Inside you is a “calm, still voice” that is outside of you as a person. This is God. Conversation between you and that voice is prayer.

    If you have such intimate connection to the Creator, why not just ask Him?

  127. Hellodie69 says:

    So I watch all of your shows every day of the week. So I’ve got a good understanding of your religious view you. The minuthe members only last night kind of made it seem like you were literally just going after Christianity or you know the whole practice of judao Christianity. I don’t understand how people feel so entitled to go after the religion that literally sparked the greatest countries in the world but are kind of hush hush on On Islam and the mostrosity’s That still take place with that religion.. Your argument seems like you were literally just trying to go after is there anything he said like a tit for tat

    • Kidtruck91 says:

      Nah, I think he appropriately pushed on Elijah’s arguments. Elijah just kinda didn’t fully have an answer. Though in his defense Elijah probably doesn’t do this kinda thing as much as Seamus or knowles.

  128. Driftinbugs says:

    Ian is the best and the perfect person to do mushrooms with. That is all I got from the entire video. Let’s go!

  129. Jakers says:

    It doesn’t happen very often, but I’m totally on board with Ian’s take at the end there.

  130. Uncle_Pauly says:

    The threads of your fate have been spun already for men and gods alike. Live the best you can and inspire those who would call you their ancestor. Have a whiskey and hug your loved ones. Peace. Out.

  131. CaptainCookie says:

    Tim let me just define agnosticism, atheism, and theism for you. Theism vs atheism is whether or not you believe there is a god, while agnosticism vs gnosticism is whether or not you know. You can be an agnostic atheist or theist. Sydney would be an agnostic atheist, while Elijah would be a gnostic theist. I am a gnostic atheist when it comes to Christianity, and some other religions that I have studied but an agnostic atheist when it comes to other religions that I do not know much about. The argument about what term would be used to describe what Sydney is was just a Sitch’s law argument. You were arguing definitions, not substance. Great episode guys!

  132. Masshole says:

    This Elijah guy isn’t as articulate as he thinks he is. I find him hard to listen to. He just doesn’t really speak that well.

  133. SilverBear says:

    Tim is ignoring Elijah’s answers to make his own point. Pretty typical of someone who isn’t ready to accept Jesus. The only discussion that should ever happen between a Christian and a non believer should be the non believer asking how to get saved. Otherwise it’s just a waste of time for both people as you can see here. Tim is a non believer and will be until he decides to accept Christ. This is the only thing that this conversation revealed.

  134. Russ says:

    It is the nature of humans to make something very simple into something very complex due to humans lack of understanding.

    There is one consciousness which we are all share. There is one life which we are all a part of. Everything is conscious and alive in its own way. This is the simple truth and fact.

    BTW Tim, the laws of physics are not laws at all including the speed of light which constantly varies. Please check Rupert Sheldrake and Graham Hancock. See here:
    http://wokedaddy.com/2017/05/29/these-two-banned-ted-talks-will-make-you-question-everything/

  135. TheReasoningPatriot says:

    First, Mormonism is a cult and doesn’t have any answers when it comes to God or Christianity. Their message is apostasy.

    Second, @Tim Pool – no, if you do not know about Christ you are not condemned.

    Romans 5:13
    To be sure, sin was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not charged against anyone’s account where there is no law.

    In God’s case, ignorance of the law is an excuse. God does not condemn those who have no knowledge of the Gospel message of Christ’s substitutionary sacrifice. If you’re catastrophically mentally challenged and have no concept of sin/right/wrong you go to heaven. If you die as an infant, you go to Heaven. If you live you whole life as a hermit with no knowledge of the outside world and you’ve never heard of Christ, you go to Heaven. Yes, if you hear the Gospel and choose to reject God, you condemn yourself.

    • EKennedy says:

      I’m concerned of the lack of Jesus Christ, Son of God, Redeemer of Man, in this conversation.

      God loved mankind so much that He sent His son as a witness, redeemer, and savior.
      No other world religion makes the claim to have a witness to God’s glory, a redeemer who bears the burdens of each sinner, and a savior that would voluntarily take upon himself your life-long sin, & go thru torture, pain, and suffering-up to death so that You wouldn’t have to pay the price of your sin yourself.
      He, voluntarily, was nailed to a tree, was crucified and died. He was buried in the borrowed tomb of a rich man. Three days later angels rolled back the stone & He arose from the grave. He met & spoke to his friends and disciples to give them “The Good News” – He was Alive – and is still alive today.
      If a sinner believes in Him, that Christ took their sin upon himself b/c He loves them that much, their sins will be forgiven. Not because of their goodness, but because of His, and they shall live with Him in Paradise after death in this world.

      Let me note, a “redeemed” sinner is not perfect, does not act perfect, nor lives a perfect life-the “saved” are still very much human. But there has been a spiritual transformation, and the sinner is saved from his sin (eternal death), because Christ died in the sinner’s place. As a result of being “saved” the desire to turn from evil ways and become more “Christ-like” is increasingly important.

      Tim, keep asking questions, you’ll find your answers. Ian, keep learning about the things you don’t know, and sharing about the things you do. Great work Tim & staff. You give me a place to go to with current events, makers/shakers, while balancing that with Cast Castle! I appreciate all the fun (I mean hard work) that goes into the production. Thank You!

  136. Ozzy says:

    Lol tim just read the bible if you want answers. Also dont expect to understand the reasons of why God does what He does, those reasons may be beyond our human comprehension. Theres a reason its called faith. You submit yourself completely to Him. Its hard to do, its not supposed to be easy.

  137. hazlema says:

    Tim Pool: “The universe is perfect”
    My Answer: The universe is perfect because that’s all you have ever known. There could be errors in the code that created the universe, but because you are a spectator and not a designer of that code you perceive it as what is meant to happen.

  138. SpencerDHarmon says:

    I love the new producer interjecting Mormons have the answers. Short answer God knows the hearts and wills of all people. If you or someone you loved we’re not able you hear the gospel before their death they will be given an opportunity to accept it. Elijah is 100% correct though. God never removes himself from our lives we remove ourselves from his standard.
    Good people who never had the opportunity to hear the gospel are not condemned to hell. There are two churches, the Church of God and the Church of the devil. And by their fruits you shall know them.
    I have never begrudged atheist or people who are agnostic because the version of God they have in their minds is terrifying and I wouldn’t want to believe in it either.

  139. KingConey says:

    Start talking about theology to a conservative watch logic go out the window Lmaooo, great content y’all!!

  140. Scafflaww says:

    Tim provides the best counter argument to Christianity.

  141. CavScout says:

    I’m also a godless heathen, but I still thought he was answer allyour questions. It was weird though, like you were so dead set on refusing it that you couldn’t even hear an answer. Probably because you hated the answer was what you’d find the most fair, and it burned you that it’s supposedly written in the Bible that way.

    Ironically, I’m kinda there with Ian, minus all the drug shit or trying to worship the CMB… and energy can be created. Sure, we’re surrounded by energy, so therefore it seems we burn energy to harvest energy out of the CMB (theory), but it’s the friction between dust in the universe that electrifies all these magnetic fields. We don’t really detect that sort of thing here, due to it being on such a macro, far away cause. The Sun is the focal point of energy. A pole to a connection. Not exploding gases or nuclear fission gone wild.

  142. Golddess says:

    The problem with saying that everyone who willfully rejects God goes to hell (and the problem that I thought Tim was leading towards), is that it’s not about accepting or rejecting God, it’s about do I accept God, Zeus, Odin, Amun-Ra, or FSM, just to name a tiny miniscule number of deities. If you tell me about God’s existence and I say that that’s not for me, you may see it as I am willfully rejecting God, but in my mind I am not rejecting God, you have chosen to reject Glorbotrol.

    But I will concede that since y’all never went down that path I’m just speculating as to what “willful rejection” means to Elijah.

  143. Jekabrew says:

    Elijah should have quoted Romans1:18-23

    18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, 19 because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, 21 because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Professing to be wise, they became fools, 23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man—and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things.

  144. Quebecoite says:

    I was working, listening in the background, then suddenly…. FRENCH!

    And I thought I couldn’t love Sydney more!

  145. groberts1980 says:

    I think it’s bizarre that Sydney is so devoted to being categorized as an Atheist and refuses to consider whether she could be Agnostic. Is she a member of the cult of Atheists?

  146. Hynzie says:

    Maybe the best discussion yet! I did not like how dismissive Sidney was when you told her that she was agnostic. I think she just does t understand the definition. I believe Elijahs explained “The path” to heaven and hell in a way that didn’t speak to you. I think what he was say, and I hope this is true, is that if you are a decent person, no matter what you are taught or have knowledge of you will go to heaven and if you don’t meet gods bar he will reveal himself to you in an undeniable way and give you the chance to choose heaven over hell. This is for those will little knowledge. People with vast knowledge of god who choose evil will not be afforded this chance at repentance and will be condemned

    • Ozzy says:

      Thats what happened to me when I was younger. I was a trouble maker, wicked, and at one point satanic. Then I started to experience things I could not explain. Long story short I was made certain that God is absolutely real, and from that point on it felt like I was finally “awake”. This is why I dont hate wicked people, because when I was that way I really had no clue what I was doing, like I was caught in a haze of confusion.

  147. keldan says:

    I was going to leave it at my first comment, but after watching the rest of the after-show I have to say something the Elijah missed.

    THE REASON THE PROFESSED ATHEIST HOLDS OUT THAT 1% IS BECAUSE THAT 1% KNOWS OF GOD AND SHE HAS SO FAR NOT BEEN GIVEN UP AS REPROBATE BY GOD.

    Romans 1 says that everything made by God knows of God and there is no excuse. But, He will eventually give you up as unfit for His kingdom and reject you, if you continue to reject Him.

    Think about that!

  148. ChrisTovHD says:

    Also, did Tim say “entropy” and “etropy”? Correct me if I’m wrong, but I’m fairly certain the latter is not a word.

  149. ChrisTovHD says:

    Well if you are displeased with the answers you received, why not seek out a conversation with someone else on the show? This topic has been the subject of numerous conversations, why now did you choose to bring up your disagreements? Surely a sincere person would be willing to have this same conversation with others who are perhaps more knowledgeable on the subject? Perhaps someone older who has had more life experiences who could provide better pushback against your arguments?

  150. EmilyCannata says:

    Elijah & Sydney & Tim together is my favorite vibe

  151. Hieronymus says:

    If you’re wondering what hell is like, there are places on Earth who fully reject God.. and by default place lesser beings into this role. It doesn’t end well.

    Communism is hell’s contagion and consumes those without a robust spiritual immune system. Here’s something that happened in Romania:

    “Examples of torture included: forcing prisoners who did not renounce their Christian faith to take a “communion” consisting of fecal matter, forcing prisoners who did not confess to anti-communist activities to put their hands in chamber pots full of urine, forcing inmates to spit into the mouths of suspected spies, and forcing prisoners to mock Christ’s nativity on Christmas day. Survivors claim that Turancu was especially creative with priests and devout Christians. Every morning, these inmates would be “baptized” with urine and fecal matter. Their heads would be held inside the putrid buckets almost to the point of drowning.”

    Now imagine that without the ability to die and escape these servants of Satan, and you have hell. It is no small coincidence that the freest nation on Earth began with a strongly Christian culture.. after all if God didn’t give you your rights, someone else gets that particular cookie jar and can share them with whom he pleases.

    Probably no small coincidence that our rights evaporating like gasoline on a hot day has something to do with our religious decline. And a reason why churches were a big priority for COVID shutdowns.

    This is why I think we may be approaching the end times. Imagine a North Korea style government that spans the entire Earth? Would need a little divine intervention at that point, and most would cheer a holy fire from the sky.

  152. M.p.v.carney says:

    What Tim isn’t understanding in the first part, in my opinion, rejecting and choosing, is seperate from knowing God. You can follow or reject him regardless, it’s about living a good life and putting life and freedom above selfishness and destruction.

  153. Largoguide says:

    Sydney how dare you try to get Tim in a gotcha moment, u should know that only Tim is allowed to get ppl in gotcha moments, only Tim can spend a whole conversation trying to contradict ppl and not trying to see the other side of a argument. The reason he kept saying Elijah didn’t answer his question is bc he spent the whole time Elijah was talking trying to figure out a way to contradict him instead of trying to understand him

  154. RickCleland says:

    Leave poor Sydney alone!!

  155. Sage says:

    JOHN PIERCE HAS DISAPPEARED!!

    July 9 IRL guest John Pierce, defending many of the Capitol Hill rioters, has ‘disappeared’ and is nowhere to be found. He had threatened to release information on FBI collusion with the riots.
    Tim, you have got to cover this

  156. sloanmatthews says:

    I get it. We’ve got to theorize and discuss these things.
    If the God I worship could fit into my 11 pound head, he would not be a God worth worshiping.
    We are given the Bible.
    We’ve got a guide, but to we are going to rationalize the intentions of the being that created everything?

  157. Axiomx says:

    Tim, In the scientific community what you are referring to is called the Fine-Tuned Theory (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fine-tuned_universe) or, in lay person’s terminology, Intelligent Design. Wherein the laws of physics, as we know them, are immutable, constant and perfect for existence of all things as we know them. Given a single change of the smallest magnitude would in fact change everything. This theory and it’s ramification has caused much consternation among the non-deist scientific community because the logical extrapolation is that God exists.

  158. minmin says:

    As a Catholic, I believe in extradimensional hyper-intelligent alien entities. We can’t perceive them because they’re outside the dimensions we can see or understand. I think these entities are called angels. It’s probably relevant to say that in some translations of the bible, the term ‘angels’ is translated simply as ‘gods.’ But anyway, like an NPC in world of warcraft, there’s no way we can see or hear from a developer unless one of the devs chooses to communicate with us. I think angels (and demons) fit this description perfectly. Maybe the comparison to NPCs is unfair, but if you take as given that there is intelligent life that exists in 4th, 5th, 6th etc. dimensions, it follows that compared to them, we are basically NPCs. Chickens. ‘Simulation’ theory tracks with this idea too, you just have to allow for the possibility that it’s not humans, or even 3-dimentional intelligent life running the simulation. Now, follow me one step further: ancient polytheistic religions don’t conflict with this idea either. If God made angels to run various laws of nature, and some of these angels turned against God, while retaining the faculties God gave them, maybe ancient people would form polytheistic religions based on devotion to one or more of these ‘gods.’

  159. PhatJimmy says:

    Elijah has an Arminian view on salvation, hell, and eschatology.

    The Bible says that all people have inherited their sinful nature from Adam. Therefore, all people who have never trusted in Jesus for repentance and salvation go to hell. There are no exceptions for people who have never ‘heard’ about Jesus. This is why missionaries go out and share the Gospel with people who have never heard it before.

    • Shane_Sakal01 says:

      Ah! I think we have discovered the Calvinist.
      If my assumption is correct, how do you get to the point where God is *not* directly and ultimately responsible for all sin and evil? As the WCF says (more or less) “Nothing comes into existence, but that God has decreed it be so.”

      • Knightsbridge says:

        Excerpts from an article by John Piper:

        How God governs all events in the universe without sinning, and without removing responsibility from man, and with compassionate outcomes is mysterious indeed! But that is what the Bible teaches. God “works all things after the counsel of his will” (Ephesians 1:11).

        This “all things” includes the fall of sparrows (Matthew 10:29), the rolling of dice (Proverbs 16:33), the slaughter of his people (Psalm 44:11), the decisions of kings (Proverbs 21:1), the failing of sight (Exodus 4:11), the sickness of children (2 Samuel 12:15), the loss and gain of money (1 Samuel 2:7), the suffering of saints (1 Peter 4:19), the completion of travel plans (James 4:15), the persecution of Christians (Hebrews 12:4-7), the repentance of souls (2 Timothy 2:25), the gift of faith (Philippians 1:29), the pursuit of holiness (Philippians 3:12-13), the growth of believers (Hebrews 6:3), the giving of life and the taking in death (1 Samuel 2:6), and the crucifixion of his Son (Acts 4:27-28).

        From the smallest thing to the greatest thing, good and evil, happy and sad, pagan and Christian, pain and pleasure – God governs them all for his wise and just and good purposes (Isaiah 46:10). Lest we miss the point, the Bible speaks most clearly to this in the most painful situations. Amos asks, in time of disaster, “If a calamity occurs in a city has not the LORD done it?” (Amos 3:6). After losing all ten of his children in the collapse of his son’s house, Job says, “The LORD gave and the LORD has taken away. Blessed be the name of the LORD” (Job 1:21). After being covered with boils he says, “Shall we indeed accept good from God and not accept adversity?” (Job 2:10).

        All of us are sinners. We deserve to perish. Every breath we take is an undeserved gift. We have one great hope: that Jesus Christ died to obtain pardon and righteousness for us (Ephesians 1:7; 2 Corinthians 5:21), and that God will employ his all-conquering, sovereign grace to preserve us for our inheritance (Jeremiah 32:40). We surrender this hope if we sacrifice this sovereignty.

        https://www.desiringgod.org/articles/why-i-do-not-say-god-did-not-cause-the-calamity-but-he-can-use-it-for-good

        • Shane_Sakal01 says:

          I really feel that the theology espoused by DesiringGod and Ligonier, among others is inherently self-contradictory.
          John Piper, for one, has self-contradiction as the basis of his whole theology. God causes/creates all instances of sin and evil, but is “mysteriously” not evil himself.
          He does the same that all Calvinists do: use complicated language to get around a simple deduction in the concept of evil if “God controls all things intimately.”
          The verses he picks can easily mean *not* what he asserts, so quote-mining the Bible is a bit inert.
          It’s in the WCF. Literal self-contradiction disguised as “deep theology.”

  160. Largoguide says:

    If Tim could have a conversation without trying to have his “gotcha” moments it would be a much better discussion

  161. Tsheehan says:

    Half of this video could have been resolved easily.

    CS lewis said

    I think that every prayer which is sincerely made even to a false god, or to a very imperfectly conceived true God, is accepted by the true God and that Christ saves many who do not think they know him. For He is (dimly) present in the good side of the inferior teachers they follow. In the parable of the Sheep and Goats those who are saved do not seem to know that they have served Christ.”

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emeth

    • Lee14dude says:

      That’s not right either its ur saved and rapture ready or lost and left behind the hard truth is hard to swallow but people just want everything good in life without seeking the meaning of life which is the Jesus for only Jesus can break the chain of sin through his blood atonement for he died for all sins and all u have to do is believe in what Jesus has done not what we do through faith, but we’re low on those these days welcome to the end days these days must come to past

    • Thirdsonofseven says:

      C.S. Lewis sims it up in “the last battle” You served Tash faithfully and with honor, so you belong to me, and those who worship me unfaithful belong to Tash.
      Asland summarized.
      “You shall know me by many names.”
      Jesus summarized
      Look into the lost-banned gossips
      Interesting take on being christ like instead of blind submissive acceptance.
      You gotta work for it, and yes God is a dick but he’s our dick.

  162. PeterOrchard says:

    What happens when you turn the video game off? Do the NPC’s join you in the real world? What happens when the universe is turned off (or life itself) by the celestial dimensional God? Why would our consciousness or soul join it? This is my problem with using video games as an analogy. As far as we can comprehend all answers don’t look good. I believe God exists, but I don’t think we stand a chance to become one with him. That is unless we ourselves are God good and bad, along with the rest of the universe. I’m probably wrong about that. Lol

    • Thirdsonofseven says:

      You would be surprised how many people stand with you on this thought. C.s. Lewis and more importantly Tolkien had this belief as well. This idea that we are all god attempting to experience the creation.

  163. Zuk04busa_ says:

    Tim is using science and word play to believe in god. Do you breath sharpe-producing? Everything he says has deeper meaning than he has not researched. Yet all in the while all man made. Like word oxygen in 1786 by Antoine Lavoisier. Just like the guy I worked with tells me to explain consciousness. So I used his argument back at him where did the word come from and what’s the definition. What year was it made by man. To ad on to that do all living things have the same god plants and animals or there just part of gods human experiment? I think religion was the original government to try and keep order of the craziness of people. Story tellers can always shape society for good or bad.

  164. Casey says:

    Good stuff guys thanks for all you do.

  165. tr_greenwell04@ymail.com says:

    It’s so true that the LDS (Mormon) religion answers a lot of Tim’s questions. Those who have not been given the opportunity to know the religion, will be given the opportunity to accept it after life. I’m not an active member but was raised LDS, and I find it to be the most logical religion in this sense. They do “baptisms for the dead” in order to allow those souls to accept the church after life. I think all religions are full of hypocrisy and weird/confusing “rules” and beliefs including the LDS. Elijah did NOT explain this well. Especially not for Tim to understand or accept as he didn’t have a clear answer to his questions. Tim, if you truly want to find answers to your questions, I would suggest looking into the LDS beliefs. Not advocating following it; just researching.

  166. Plastdunk says:

    after viewing the series “Resident Alien” I finally understands Ian..
    He even looks like Alan Tudyk.

    So sad i cant superchat this vital information, since you are on the wrong side of the globe 🙂
    And if you havent seen this, do it, really funny, the most fun i seen in a long time and they keep it together 🙂

  167. HadesXY says:

    thanks to the hot mic i cant wait seeing lex an tim together

  168. ALOMARI88 says:

    To Tim and cast and all members pleas invite an Islamic intellectual prospective on religion and the reality of life i recommend someone who can speak to all and the political world
    Mohammed hijab fund him on YouTube “speakers corner” pleas watch this on atheist or agnostic
    https://youtu.be/cN9qtDx0KsU

  169. Kinakomochi says:

    This convo needs jordan Peterson’s perspective about bible and religion..

  170. Waaterbee says:

    I understand that people need spirituality. But any argument on the veracity of one god just makes me laugh.

    First, if god created us in his image, why is our windpipe connected to our digestive system? Why do we have an appendix, and a spine that’s sort of cobbled together and not optimized for walking? Why do we have so many flaws?

    Second, why does god choose the most obscure methods to tell people about him, such as weird visions, a millenia-old book that was mistranslated over and over, and the people who claim to speak for him? He clearly made babies that know from minute one how to cry. How to eat, how to breathe. Why doesn’t everyone just know that god is real, from the moment they’re born? Why do they have to be told?

    Third, if god is so hard to understand, then how do you claim to understand him? How can you claim to speak for him? Have you considered that maybe you’re being tricked by the equivalent of the devil? What if the other religions are right?

    Fourth, if humans are so unique, how come many animals can do similar things to humans? Dolphins are clearly capable of incredible evils, including torturing other animals for pleasure, and organized, pre-orchestrated gang rape. Chimps and other primates steal and lie. And even ravens can trick and deceive. Rats show compassion. If none of these have a soul, there’s very little that makes a soul really necessary – and conveniently, the soul is claimed to do things that are unverifiable and unfalsifiable. Also, I’d like someone to explain to me whether mental conditions like Alzheimer’s, depression, memory loss, or even lobotomies will be fixed in heaven… and why.

    In short, I completely agree with Tim. If there’s a god – a creator, an origin of sorts – then he made the program, and the program runs fairly smoothly (though I don’t believe that it runs as perfectly as Tim describes it, considering that we are discovering very small random elements in the quantum world, e.g. matter coming into existence spontaneously). That’s a respectable job if some entity did that. But Christianity, and all religions, seem to me like the makings of imperfect humans.

  171. smilomaniac says:

    It’s very simple.

    God hates what he created and left.

    • smilomaniac says:

      I do actually have an answer for Tim.

      An Inuit hunter asked the local missionary priest: ‘If I did not know about God and sin, would I go to hell?’ ‘No,’ said the priest, ‘not if you did not know.’ ‘Then why,’ asked the Inuit earnestly, ‘did you tell me?’ — Annie Dillard

      That’s basically what Tim argues, but it’s not that the Inuit was right, it’s that the priest failed.

      If you are ignorant of God, you are judged on a different scale, you are “subhuman” in the sense that you are below potential of man, the “perfect creation of God”.
      (We are obviously not perfect, but think of it more along the lines of God making a bet that he could create a being that crawled out of the mud and will one day become a God themselves).

      If you are NOT ignorant and you know better, then your conscience should bid you to be good and demonstrate to others that if you follow the path to God, how much better life is, which is in a sense true.
      If you know better and don’t do it, then you have “failed the test” and have chosen, willfully, to be a bad person and so you belong in hell.
      If you know better but it hurts too much, you’re addicted to drugs, are missing two limbs and also are a complete addict to computer games, then your hardship is taken into account and so are the failures of the people around you – Because we are in this together. Which selfless choices did you make while being weak yourself? Those choices will outweigh your circumstances and let you enter the gates of heaven.

      The incentive is there: Potential to become one with God, a bliss and experience so otherwordly and fulfilling, an existence without regret and pain. Before that you do good, help others become good and foster a society of love.

      I don’t think hell exists, I think it’s another name for purgatory where you’re not meant to be for eternity and I don’t think it’s supposed to be punishment as much as therapy, to fix the damage you did to your spirit while alive, then to be delivered to God and become one with the bliss, free from the damage you did.

      Hell doesn’t make sense, either God forgives all or he doesn’t.
      If hell existed and God genuinely warned people to join him or go to hell, then God is not perfect and someone else is as powerful or more powerful than God, taking people away from him, like two powerful aliens feeding off of our souls – Maybe neither are good but have just developed a system to split the food between themselves.

      Just to TL;DR this:
      You don’t go to hell, you just live a life of ignorance and will be unaware of the potential of good. From there your actions determine where you go.
      Without people who believe in God, you get nothing and the rest just feed off of them.

  172. Aero says:

    The Rapture seems like it can potentially be an excuse for a genocide…

  173. TheMaybeTroll says:

    I am glad to see the conviction of the holy spirit on Tim working in real time. What is funny the question Tim is poseing about the isolated man he also answers but he is not listening to the conclusion. God created nature and Nature it’s self is declaring there is a God. God created a being with the ability to Think, Reason and discern patterns from nature so no man can claim ignorance of him, no not one. But if a person is seeking the God of creation then passes into death in the process of seeking the christ/the one prefect being, yes I believe you will be saved because Salvation is the act of humbling oneself before the Lord God Almighty but if you are not seeking the Lord God Almighty and reject the witness of the Christ the one prefect being needed for intercession of the world you will not be saved because humans are beings with the ability to ration. So not one person can claim ignorance this is what’s known as the unforgivable sin.

  174. Amagicion says:

    On the discussion of the universe being perfect: There are 2 HUGE issues that arise. First, Tim is using “perfect” as a synonym for consistent. This causes a whole slew of weird interactions with the crowd because they all have a different interpretation of perfection in regards to the universe. Second, Tim is actually just incorrect here. There are tons of really strange happenings where particles appear and disappear seemingly without cause, they just all happen at the atomic level. Even with the way matter interacts, it is technically mathematically possible for solid objects to simply phase through each other when we expect them to collide, it just requires trillions of particles to all simultaneously have events whose chance of occurrence is nearly infinitesimally small. These “glitches” in the universe are one of the things putting a minimum size on processing chips because at the atomic scale they ran into issues of inconsistency due to particles phasing between paths.

  175. Itswhithakay says:

    At first Tim was aggravating but then Sydney took the cake. Elijah did great explaining things, Tim made great logical arguments concerning the consistency of the laws of nature and how we have faith in authorities on many things we believe. Ian, I just, just keep doing you bud

    But yeah to elijahs point
    No one is perfect except Jesus
    Even the best people have sins
    God is perfect in judgement
    And I agree I think he judges according to ones knowledge and is somehow presented even to those who don’t know the gospel and perhaps if that’s not they case they are judged solely in n works 🤷‍♀️

  176. RustyTech says:

    I’ve been getting back into religion lately and even my own personal faith and man Elijah just sent me right back to being totally skeptical. Elijah’s version of god is a mix of scary goat farmer tall tales and Stalin’s ghost. I’m all set.

  177. MadmanMarines says:

    Elijah believes that you accept God and go to heaven OR you live in torment in hell.
    This is essentially SUBMIT OR BURN IN HELL forever, Bro fuck that shit and shame on you. what about the babies that die before baptism? what about all the native americans before Christianity got here? He sounds EXACTLY like the LEFT, submit or else.
    When I was Lutheran my Pastor told me when you die and are judged, if you are truly sorry for your sins again, TRULY sorry, you can go to heaven which may not be true but that is far more in line with what Christ himself preached, forgiveness and love not damnation and hell. If God loves us so much then why would he rule with an iron fist of fear for not loving him? I guess Eli is way too extreme for me and will push free thinkers far far away which is in fact his own definition of Evil, leading people away from and thus damning them to hell.
    And Sydney wants to be atheist so bad lol.

    That being said tonight was a great bonus episode with amazing guests and cant wait to see them back on!

  178. bogey1975 says:

    The ads on this site are out of control, about cancel my membership….

  179. GatrieMc92 says:

    Elijah fundamentally misunderstands his own religion

  180. ChilliButt says:

    You guys should get Alan watts on the show.

  181. mslushin says:

    My question for Elijah based on ALL of his arguments… If Sin is absolute in its nature to condemn man regardless of his knowledge of God, as you’ve argued, then what do you believe Jesus died for?

  182. Thyme says:

    Its near impossible to listen to Tim pretend he is understanding the theological argument. Tim’s 2nd grade interpretation is akin to watching that feminist reporter go “so what your saying is” during the Jordan Peterson interview.

  183. kgres1 says:

    Christianity has become an institutionalized term. It’s not even a monotheistic view. It’s a relationship with God and recognizing there are other entities allowed to roam the Earth that have influence in humanity.

    Please bring in Justen Faull who is an actor, director, and producer of the Fourth Watch podcast. He explains supernatural and paranormal topics from a biblical perspective. He’s been criticized and shamed by many but all that doesn’t matter when God shows you Truth.

  184. keldan says:

    Hey Tim, I noticed that Elijah really doesn’t know scripture very well and I understand why you’d be a little ticked off at his answers.

    I was an atheist for most of my life, but I became a Christian 17 years ago and have studied like there’s no tomorrow since then. I’ve learned the lies that are taught in the “churches”, and have discovered that Biblical prophecy is coming to pass as we speak.

    I have a book and several web sites containing a presentation of my notes in a readable format. I’d love to send you the links and/or book if you’d like to read it.

    If you’d like to talk, I would love to.

    Sincerely,
    Dan Nordquist

  185. KMerckCPA says:

    If you want to learn more about the end times, watch Nathaniel Barlam’s illustration of Supper’s Ready on YouTube. You won’t regret it.

  186. Itswhithakay says:

    Tim seems unable to humble himself

    • Itswhithakay says:

      It’s a hard thing to do
      Also good job Elijah

    • JackONeill says:

      What the hell are you talking about?

      Tim said in this very conversation that he believes there is something higher than him, and that he cannot possibly understand the vastness of the universe.

      “X refuses to humble themselves” is a Theist ad hominem for “you refuse to accept my viewpoint.”
      I get that stupid phrase all the time from theists and I have to remind them, no I don’t refuse to humble myself. I 1000% accept there is probably something higher than me with an infinitely better understanding of the universe than me. What I refuse to “humble” myself to is bending my knee to a god, that by all accounts, is a prick!

  187. KMerckCPA says:

    Tim is dead wrong about his understanding of quantum physics. Read In Search of Schroedinger’s Cat

  188. Patrick.braswell says:

    I’m DONE. Seriously this whole conversation made me die laughing! I had to watch it like 3 times. Tim the troll man Taylor! Seriously my dude is a wizard. Best podcast ever.

  189. jorah.g says:

    Make Jesus Great Again lol

  190. mountain.drew411 says:

    Those who desire in their heart to help those around them and tell them things that will improve their lives are good people. Those things that improve others will be passed to others from them and greater numbers of people will improve their lot in this short life we all have. Not being exposed to the bible does not mean you will be condemned. Doing good that does in fact do good onto others is the best you can do if you have not been given the instructions (the Bible). I am a Christ follower is how I like to describe myself because I know he brought healing and happiness to people through his acts and miracles. As to the universe being made perfectly and beyond the complexity that any man may understand only shows me more that a perfect God knows and designed the whole thing without fault. That being said in my life I have done impure things and that lead down a path of unhappiness and when I looked at my father his whole life became better once he found God and really took it to heart and his life improved dramatically because of it. There are things on this earth that are good and bad and we’ve seen that time and again, it does seem that anything good that is on this earth lines up with what god tells us is and everything that is bad hurts your spirit and makes your miserable. It’s almost as he designed the earth in his image and it’s been shown to be true at nauseum because of the effects that things have on people and always have. Something else that I have thought, that most christians wouldn’t agree with, is astrology. I have done the zodiac sign stuff and horoscopes and honestly they come pretty close the majority of the time. But that also makes me think, couldn’t god make the stars so complex that astrology is a study of the energy that God has designed in them? Personally I believe yes but I do not worship the stars but worship the being that created them, in my heart that is God.

  191. Sleveofwizard says:

    Hey Tim and friends, please stop painting Canada with the same lockdown brush. I live in Alberta and we are just as open as Texas and have been since June.

  192. thndrbrd says:

    I mean really I’m so beyond this thought experiment. I worship life there maybe a magic unicorn in the sky or an omnipresent algorithm controlling everything, I just hope it has the understanding that I can’t possibly comprehend its function And although I appreciate all the hard work and all that it’s done, I just can’t get with idea it’s so easily offended that if I work on the 7th day I deserve to burn.

  193. IanWelch says:

    Agnostics are atheists. Atheist means “A” – without and “theist” religion. The definition is what the word means. Without religion. Tim you are an atheist. atheist is a broad term. Come on man. And tim your “idea” of god is no better than anyone else.

  194. sully27 says:

    Religion is what makes people crazy but at the same time does help people cope with the evil inside themselves.

  195. BluesBrother says:

    Pretty much -> You act out your believes and that’s the thing what matters.

  196. Kezia says:

    Find an Atheist who used to be a preacher or Christian talkshow host. Tiered of these mid wit one sided religious debates. Tim sounded dumb as hell for the first tom when he didn’t know what Atheism was. You can be unconvinced of a higher power, but be convinced with good evidence, without being labeled as agnostic.

  197. thndrbrd says:

    lol, I’m with Sydney! I hate religious debates because it’s always a circle. Then you get on the argument of different beliefs, so like the question of will Hindus go to hell for being in the wrong religion? I mean we are mice compared to God, of course e we are going to describe it (our experience) differently. Then once you get to a point in that debate, like Sydney, you’re just so pissed you’re like fine I believe I’m breathing a grilled cheese but either we now move to kinetic battle or move on from the subject. Then you have the Jews and Arab situations come about and perpetual battle over what/who the messiah is.

    I believe there is something undiscovered, I attempt to live a righteous life, but as far as the hardliners I think that is a step too far that has caused more death and destruction than good.I mean look at how many harmed themselves when they had the son of being attracted to the wrong sex! I don’t prescribe to the leftist religion now but hell if you are a guy that wants another guy go for it! However, when I become less because I’m not attracted to the same sex then it does the same as religion only in the reverse. You’re not less, you’re just apart of the human race trying to find the way through and you know your limits or preferences.

  198. IanWelch says:

    Heaven and hell is an indoctrination tactic, it’s manipulative. He’s down playing his own religion it’s cringe. “If you don’t conform to my religion you will be tormented for eternity” such a narcissistic condescending idea. I can’t stand religious people they are so delusional on another level. You can’t prove a single thing you’re saying then why say it? It’s disgusting religion is gross. You just pretend everyone just “knows” that your god is real if you were born in a muslim country you’d be muslim and if you were a india you’d be another religion, that’s a bias, that’s narcissistic. Christians are just narcissistic “im gods image” “im right and i know it” ugh cringe af

  199. DawnsHerald says:

    I feel kind of bad for saying it like this, but Elijah is terrible at explaining this. I’m not sure if I am better, but let me try to break it down. (This is going to be all over the place because this is a really big topic and you can’t really sum it up in a few sentences.)

    To start, God is a metaphysical being, meaning he only exists as an abstract concept. Any attempt to categorize God has to be PREscriptive, rather than DEscriptive, because you are not able to actually observe a concept. People tend to think of God as a magical creature that grants wishes to those that praise it, but that is an ignorant child’s understanding of what God could be. The idea of God fully encompasses three other concepts: creation, reason (Logos), and goodness. (There are probably more, but I think these three are most important.) Heaven is being in the presence of God, meaning that you are in a place where these concepts work in abundance. Hell is being forever separated from God, in a place where these concepts do not exist. Its not about pearly gates or fire and brimstone. Those are basically just artist flourishes.

    God is the act of creation, a being that creates order from chaos. Us being make in the image of God means that we can also create on a similar scale. Most of the universe is in entropy and there are only little pockets where things can be created. Even among the creatures on earth, most creation amounts to little more than digging holes or building simple nests. Humanity, on the other hand, basically has access to the source code of the universe. In Hell, creation is nonexistent. 2+2=5, nothing makes sense and any attempts at building up something better fails. Reason and logic no longer function in any meaningful way.

    I could go on about this forever, but let me summarize as best as I can. Heaven is where humanity is at their best, where we think logically and create beautiful things. Hell is an absence of that, where creation is futile and reason doesn’t exist.

  200. Sanesociopath says:

    I consider myself agnostic largely because I’d choose to go to how people tend to describe hell over heaven almost exclusively due to stubbornness to not submit to their egotistical God.

  201. ARichter says:

    I don’t agree with Elijah. Not entirely. I believe in God and I always have. I taught CCE for a decade at my local parish. I had an agreement with the diocese that I would not teach Purgatory or the Ever Virgin Mary and if questions came up, which they always did, I sent them to our parish priest. I refused to sway them either way, but I would not give them bad information, either.

    Here is hot I see it, and yes, it’s black and white. Very black and white. Black, white, good, evil, God, Satan. There are all concepts we can understand. And here is where I can answer Elijah’s Antifa influence question. Even if you are weak minded, you know good from bad. If you choose to do evil, you are evil. No excuses. You know it’s wrong. You choose to do wrong. You are wrong. That’s the way God sees it. How do I know? He told us so in the Bible.

    Purgatory doesn’t exist for that very reason. It’s a ploy by the Catholic Church to get money from people saying that prayers will get your evil loved out of there quicker. There is black, there is white. Grey areas are excuses humans make to be less culpable for the evil they do. Period. Purgatory is stupid for the same reason indulgences were stupid.

    I loved the show, I loved the extra. I needed both after a horrible day of trying to save dogs.

  202. Illusivedude says:

    Tims argument with Sydney is samatics. They disagree on the definition of atheist. A good analogy is a line that goes from red to blue on a gradient. So purple is in the middle. Lets say red is atheist and blue is theist. That makes purple agnostic. Sydney says she is 99 parts red 1 part blue. Sydney says she is red. Tim says nope theres 1% blue in you so you are purple.

    • mjbeam64 says:

      Gnosticism and theism are not mutually exclusive. A person who has had a personal experience that gives them knowledge of a deity is a gnostic. If one has not had this experience they are an agnostic. An agnostic can have a belief in a god or not, ie. they could be an agnostic theist or an agnostic atheist. Gnostic atheism would be hard to defend although one could have an experience that convinces them that no gods exist. Some call this hard atheism. Atheism is simply the lack of a belief in a god.

  203. Shapeofevil says:

    Always love Catholics trying to explain theology to Tim. Get a decent Lutheran on and it’ll go better. 🤣 We have better answers and examples to Tim’s counter points.

  204. EndTheFed says:

    Regarding Tim’s comment about a ham sandwich appearing from nowhere.

    I present to you the Boltzmann Brain.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boltzmann_brain?wprov=sfti1

    Specifically regarding the spontaneous formation section.

  205. Toddius says:

    At one point i felt like Tim was describing Q from star trek
    multidimensional energy being … or something like that.

    When I was kid, my grandmother and I did experiment with candle and glass jar. Is that proof of oxygen?

    Today I learned that I am agnostic.Since I live in post communist, 97% atheist country, I never had philosophical or theological education. We just don’t think much about this topic…

    I would like to hear Tim and Ian, to explain double slit experiment with extensions, like delayed measurement and quantum eraser.

    • Illusivedude says:

      Regarding the double slit experiment, to my memory its that to observe the light at the level they did they had to interact with it. If i recall correctly they would shoot photons or other light particles at it to try to measure it but that would change the outcome. Normally hitting something with photons or light particles is so small compared to the observed object that it doesnt change it, but what they were measuring was small enough to be changed by it… this is all if i recall correctly.

      • Toddius says:

        I have to admit that my understanding of these thing is from wikipedia and some youtube channels…
        From what I had understood is: if you use crystal that split 1 photon in 2, with 1/2 of frequency or energy. I don’t know. Do the photons are entangled. Then you implement Your measuring device on 1 of the bean…
        It will affect other one, even if measuring device is at longer distance from splitting cristal, then interference projection plane…
        I dont know what it means.
        ps. I am not native to english

  206. Wesley says:

    i love when the reason god exists is because everything is a test, and everything else you just said doesnt matter because if you dont accept god youre just wasting the amazing opportunity given to you by an almighty being who is greater than you and also also also even though most religions predate christ, those religions are just created by evil descenters who for some reason want to lie to themselves about god?

    for such an almighty being, he sure doesnt have anything interesting to do if all he cares about is creating a world just to test whether or not they will blindly put all their faith into believing, and dont forget if you dont believe, you get punished for eternity1

  207. WMTJ says:

    I’m about 50 minutes in and I’m even more relieved that I’m studying the Torah instead of the Greek Hellenism, which is what Christianity has become, more than ever. Hell is a Greek concept not a Hebraic one. Yeshua was speaking conceptually and even politically at times when he spoke of things that “bewitched” Israelites and their watering down of obedience to “ G_d’s teaching and instruction “ which is what Torah is. It’s saddening to hear this stuff perpetuate.

    Tim’s logic is spot on and Elijah is stuck in concepts that have been past down to him, which are not “biblical”. The concept of the rapture started in the 18 century and is of the occult in its establishment within Christianity. Period. G_d is within time and existence and without ( outside of) time and dimensions (existence).

    Tim should invite Yossi back for these conversations ( this one was impromptu but they should have a dedicated time for conversations like these). I have a Rabbi who could explain and answer Tim’s questions properly; Ralph Messer of STBM. These concepts and misunderstandings are explained succinctly. This was frustrating and seemed like a continual circle of nothing. “ Accept Jesus in your heart” blah blah blah…degrades the Torah and Yeshua’s work.

    Any Torah teacher or even Dr. Jordan Peterson could explain things better for an argument for G_d and, perhaps more importantly, the ethics of the Torah. The afterlife stuff – you shouldn’t even concern yourself with. While you’re living one should do Torah principles. That’s simpler and will help humanity more. What are Torah principles? Do some studying and stop expecting people to tell them to you. They are only as good as you are studying to do them and THEN to teach them…so one does need a guide or Rabbi for Jewish concepts and their context within time they were written. The foundation of the concepts of The United States’ Bill of Rights and Constitution were formed from Torah principles and these documents should be protected for all time. I believe that is more pertinent for the day we live in.

  208. UunholyBacon says:

    wow Tim i have never seen you fail so hard in a debate. was your whole argument what’s the point to exist is there is no point cause no matter what we do we will end in perfect entropy? and i think Elijah’s point was heaven and hell are not what the human mind can comprehend, they are 2 pipes you can flow into. one is basically a septic tank and the other is a clean vast lake. his point is always flow toward the lake. i hate metaphor because its dumb. Sydney’s point was i have no clue ill find out when i get their. my view not that it matters if gods the grate programmer of the unaverse sandbox i pray that he is a nerd just running existence algorithms that favor what humanity’s need to progress and not a worse case scenario kind of simulation.

  209. Rneumann32 says:

    Rapture:
    Luke 17:26-30 “It will be just like this on the day the Son of Man is revealed. 31 On that day no one who is on the housetop, with possessions inside, should go down to get them. Likewise, no one in the field should go back for anything. 32 Remember Lot’s wife! 33 Whoever tries to keep their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life will preserve it. 34 I tell you, on that night two people will be in one bed; one will be taken and the other left. 35 Two women will be grinding grain together; one will be taken and the other left.” [36] [e]
    “Where, Lord?” they asked.
    He replied, “Where there is a dead body, there the vultures will gather.”
    In the days of noah the wicked were taken, there is no rapture and no where the vultures are is a good place

    The Mark:
    Revelation 13:16-17
    And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
    And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name
    Deuteronomy 11:18-19
    “You shall therefore impress these words of mine on your heart and on your soul; and you shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontals on your forehead. You shall teach them to your sons, talking of them when you sit in your house and when you walk along the road and when you lie down and when you rise up.
    Right hand is what you do and forehead is what you think its not a physical mark
    Elyon + YHWH
    The land of Canaan was home to a polythiestic religion where Elyon was the most high god. YHWH was just a god underneath him
    Psalm 82 Hebrew Interlinear
    Elohim (capital E is YHWH) standeth in the congregation of ell he judeth among the elohim (lower case e is multiple gods)
    Deuteronomy 32:8
    When Elyon divided to the nations their inheritance when he separated the son of Adam he set the bound of the people according to the number of children of israel
    For YHWHs portion is his people, Jacob is the lot of his inheritance

    I agree with Tim there is a God but the bible is bull

  210. jhelms55@gmail.com says:

    Take a look at http://www.godinanutshell.com
    Trey Smith does a great job getting in to these complicated topics.

  211. mjbeam64 says:

    Gnostic/agnostic is about knowledge. Theism/atheism is about belief.

  212. In one of his books, Vine Deloria Jr. related that when a Christian Missionary was traveling to what is now Washington state — I think it was Marcus Whitman — as he preached the Gospel to tribal people he was surprised by how accepting they were. “You believe me?” he asked. And was happy when they said yes.

    But then he was disappointed when they would continue, “now here’s what we believe.”

    In the long ago, the Cowlitz — my people — were known as “the Spirit Seeking people.” Like tribes farther inland, they had the Medicine Wheel, which provided insights. And they saw Spirit in everything. As do I.

    What is Spirit? I don’t know. It’s a mystery. The Great Mystery.

    For practical spirituality, I enjoy L.E. Modesitt Jr’s Recluse Series. They’re good stories, full of what some might call magic. But the underlying theme is that everything is order and chaos. Chaos (Yin) is what drives everything. Order (Yang) contains and harnesses the chaos. (He doesn’t use the terms Yin and Yang, but the inspiration is obvious.) Neither is good or bad. They just are. Some “mages” are White, and harness chaos. Others are Black, and harness order. But the most powerful mages in the series are the Greys, who harness both.

    When he does get into religion, the deity is the “Nameless.” (Cue Spock giving the Vulcan salute.) Fun stories, lots of little life lessons. If I had sons, I’d give them his books to read, along with the Tom Swift series (both the old ones and the newer ones.) And maybe the standalone Edgar Rice Burroughs novels: Moon Maid, Cave Girl.

    Here’s what little I do believe that some might describe as religious: After we drop our body we enter the metempsychosis, during which we experience both our personal heaven and our personal hell. In objective time, this can require many years or many centuries. After we’re done, we return, or reincarnate.

    Obviously, I’m not a Christian. But I am a Christian sympathizer: as Tim has been touching on, recently, every culture has their stories. The founding fathers of the US were mostly Christians; or, like Jefferson, Christian sympathizers. (One, I seem to recall, was a Jew.) The nation they created is predicated on Judeo-Christian principles. In this regard, contrary to what Progressives shriek, America is a “Christian nation.” And as nations go, it’s a pretty good one.

    In its day, Rome was a pretty good one, too. The Roman public and private virtues are admirable, and many of us appreciate Stoicism, from Zeno to Marcus Aurelius. Like Buddhism and every other great religion, it provides valuable insights and lessons. But when it comes to deities, I agree with what some indigenous American shaman have to say: “Great Mystery.”

    The fact is, we do not know. So arguments about “God” or gods disinterests me. There is an uncaused cause. Something that created all that we know and experience but which was not, itself, created. What that is, is a mystery. It is the Great Mystery.

  213. Williamsr says:

    This was the way I wish religion was taught. Question everything seek your own conclusions. This was a great conversation.

  214. DionysianPirate says:

    I will preface this by saying I am not religious, and fall more on the agnostic side of things.

    Mathematics is not absolute. It is absolute like 99.99999 percent of the time. The one thing the mathematician has to contend with is the infinite. It is a concept that has alluded humans for some time. Cantor thought he saw God in absolute infinity but also proved that there are some sets of infinity bigger than other sets of infinity. Although the concept of absolute infinity landed him in the loony bin numerous times there is something to be learned here. Absolute infinity is something we struggle with and can never fully grasp, like God. The sets of infinity Cantor was working with is akin to the bible. Reading the bible can give you a greater conception of what God is, but never bring you to a full understanding of the infinite.

    The idea or concept of God is just the human mind’s way of grappling with the complexities of infinity. Infinity here is analogous to God. Every field has to grapple with something beyond its understanding. For religion it’s God. For mathematics and physics it’s the infinite. For biologists it’s evolution and the unmoved mover as Aristotle put it.

    Another problem that can arise from this is, testimony. Which can be boiled down to metaphysics and epistemology. In other words, What do we know and how do we know it? Hume and Al-Ghazali thought the only a priori knowledge we can know is cause and effect. Betwixt me and you, you really shouldn’t go down the rabbit hole on this one. If God is the unmoved mover then there is a finite nature to this God we speak. If the nature of God is infinite then there is a boulder big enough that God can’t lift it. Alright, too many thoughts, let’s rein it in.

    I guess the question I ask myself is, not whether God exists, but rather is there intention to this squishy conceptual idea (or entity). I would say no. At the end of the day, I’ll just take Pascal’s wager with my understanding of God and live my life.

  215. DearthRibbet says:

    You guys should have a pastor/ priest on to give a better explanation. I think it be a better conversation regarding what Christianity is. I love Elijah and Sydney, but I don’t think they are the right people to have this conversation. I fully support you guys having it. Thanks for the interesting conversation!

  216. DearthRibbet says:

    You guys should have a pastor/ priest on to give a better explanation. I think it be a better conversation regarding what the religion of Christianity is. I love Elijah and Sydney, but I don’t think they are the right people to have this conversation. I fully support you guys having it. Thanks for the interesting conversation!

  217. ZedS says:

    I’m only halfway through this video and I’m done with it. It’s very obvious when Tim is listening and having a conversation in good faith and when he isn’t. The last time I saw him like this was when he was trying to impress on Seamus that abortion is not bad inherently.

    • SaltyGranny says:

      I wish I would have stopped watching it too. Tim turned total dick mode on Sidney. It was disgusting to see, and I had hoped Elijah would knock him down a peg, but nope. Just sat there.. just like Ian always does.

  218. Heimburglar says:

    “You yourself choose if you go to Heaven”

    “When you’re judged if you go to Heaven”

    Which is it? Is Peter there with his book or not.

    “Natural Law isn’t just there, you think it just sprang out of the big bang”
    well where did god come from? Just sprang out of nowhere?

    i take alot of issue with christianity.
    God is perfect and i must “follow god”
    and i have 400 denominations i can choose from to find him. So. 399 are incorrect because god is perfect as you say. So any incorrect gospel is defiling his being. So thats a bullshit trap. Man is fallible as written in the bible, by men. So you mean to tell me theres an accurate record of his will?

    I guess the African children who are mining our minerals so we can text about how well we know about God are bad people because God has been censored in their life. So they cant love him. They know only discomfort and will never meet god. Look at your north korean guest. If god is going to condemn all NK to hell because he literally CANT EXIST there without punishment of death. Then yeah. Tim is right. God is a dick.

    Heaven would make sense being a gradient. The more you think like god, the more you enjoy afterlife. Like a football game. Team heaven wins. If you are satanic, its the worst place to be. If you’re on team Heaven, then its the best place in the world. If you don’t believe in either, you’re just bored.

  219. Tuna says:

    Hum.. interesting episode, but growing up with Taoist and Buddhist influences, I believe in good karma and perhaps face trial if I did bad things. All my ancestor believe this and never heard of existence of god. I respect Christian god and people with other religion , but I believe I will go with my ancestors after I die.

  220. ArinPeters says:

    Ian “DMT” 👾

  221. BuoyD says:

    Elijah, you say humans condemn themselves, but God knows where you’ll end up before you’re even born. Which make free will redundant, as well as the statement that we condemn ourselves to hell.

    • Younser says:

      It doesn’t really need to be explained. It fits into the concept of infinity, which we do not understand, and also God if you believe him to exist, clearly operates on a plane of existence that are not beholden to the laws of the material world that we have been discovering. Like trying to explain the concept of a cube to a square, it wouldn’t even be able to understand that it was part of the cube, beyond a feeling of being part of something bigger, let alone understand that there are 5 other faces all unaware of each other or the world each face is part of. So not really something worth getting hung up on, you have free will for all intents and purposes, how God knows what God knows is anyone’s guess, perhaps space is not linear to him, maybe he knows and inhabits every outcome of every decision. It doesn’t really matter.

  222. henk says:

    i remember why i hate religion lol

  223. Freya1104 says:

    I understand religious folks and respect their right to believe as they believe but it’s hilarious to me when really religious people get their ideas challenged and are immediately super defensive like Tim said it really is like the woke cult that has sprung up.. not to mention shit like catholic priests and little boys seem to be just accepted in our society and that incredible hypocrisy turns me away from religion altogether

  224. Worm says:

    There is a profound sadness to those that (like Elijah) insist that the mythical metaphorical description of reality is a literal concept. Jordan B. Peterson is the way to truly understand that WE do not KNOW. ‘Who are you to say that you believe.’ The true sin is to proclaim YOU know the truth of GOD.

  225. DearthRibbet says:

    If y’all want to get out of DC come down to Southern Maryland (Calvert and Saint Mary’s Counties) its a community of God and Gun loving Americans!

  226. Nlindskog says:

    Tim is correct in my view the universe is like explaining blockchain to ants X infinity the concept of God is just the current elementary phase

  227. wcrews says:

    I like how everyone was having an intense opinion and then ian came in at the end and literally just explained Jedi Lore but really badly

  228. texhead says:

    Can I just ask for the Comment area be put at the top of the comments please and put a ‘return to top’ button at the bottom for easier navigation.
    I was going to rant as I am a dedicated christian and love people very much and find it really ‘sad’ when questions that are asked, because of there complexity, can’t be answered in five minutes.
    Your statement that the natural laws are perfect is genuinely humble, not everyone sees this and science cannot explain this through evolution. To think the laws of nature evolved is ludicrous, to think that they happened instantly at the point of the Big Bang without a creator with a perfect mind is also ludicrous.
    As you stated and Sydney also is that you can’t believe in a personal God. He is personal as I and millions of others have experienced. He is the God of the ‘collective’ and the ‘individual’ at the same time. God is perfect and wants a perfect existence for each one of us.
    Rejection of God entered into perfection through Adam causing the repercussions to occur in the world. And, putting it very simply, then mankind fell under ownership of Satan. For God to re-own humanity he could not break his own spiritual laws, as no law can be changed once spoken. That’s when he sent his Son Jesus to die on the cross. The bible said he redeemed us, redemption is to bye back. Tim, with your mind, you would love the real, intense and practical logic of Faith, it really is that good. God meets us on all levels, feelings, emotions, logic, supernatural you name it, He is much more than we can think or imagine, BUT he says he is here for us as individuals to guide us into ALL truth.
    Christianity is not a religion as defined these days, it’s a relationship.
    Here’s one for Ian, It says that God is Omnipotent (all powerful) and omnipresent (everywhere at all times). Think on this… God is everywhere, at all times, at all times. God is outside of time because He created it. When He was asked who He was He said tell them ‘I am’. He ‘is’ at the beginning of creation and at the end and everywhere in between at all times. Time is something we have to live in for cause and effect, atrophy and entropy. Nothing over time was by accident. Why are there great deposits of coal and oil, results of decomposed organic matter? All in the plan!
    I love you guys and this episode was epic. Keep it going.
    [from Queensland Australia]
    P.S. You will see the glory of God and will be convinced one way or the other. God is love, God is good, God is peace, God is our provider, God is our protector, God is!

  229. HenrikasE says:

    Simply, Christians are the biggest hypocrites of their religion.
    If you really would believe what you say, you would scream from mountain top.

  230. PennsWoodsPolitical says:

    The “Glitch” tim is looking for is the virgin birth. That certainly doesnt happen in physics without changing the code. Elijah got worked up. Cant bring ppl around in 1 hour.

  231. HenrikasE says:

    Guys, red gospel of Thomas the uncorrupted word of Christ.
    Ore read “The immortality key the secret history of the religion without no name”.
    Read books, learn ancient history, talk with budist priests, monk’s. All religion is simply racketeering of the ignorant, but humanity neads something to believe in to, for life is to much suffering.
    “If you say you know what does God mean, you simply do not understand anything about it”

  232. VeganSausage says:

    Hell is not a place of fire and pitchforks. Hell is eternal solitude, alone forever, unable to rejoin the Universal Consciousness.

    • HenrikasE says:

      Guys, red gospel of Thomas the uncorrupted word of Christ.
      Ore read “The immortality key the secret history of the religion without no name”.
      Read books, learn ancient history, talk with budist priests, monk’s. All religion is simply racketeering of the ignorant, but humanity neads something to believe in to, for life is to much suffering.
      “If you say you know what does God mean, you simply do not understand anything about it”

  233. c0de6349 says:

    you guys are getting hung up on the wrong things. god is inside everyone. morality. there is a scale.

  234. pantherage says:

    Went from one of the most enjoyable shows to one of the most annoying after shows.
    You wasted some fun guests with this garbage.
    Ian’s craziness was sometimes a welcome relief.

  235. Fringedhorizon says:

    Holy shit, I haven’t seen it yet. Just by that title you know it’s gonna be a banger!! I love all you guys do!

  236. VeganSausage says:

    God IS the universe.

  237. jeffmjoy07@yahoo.com.au says:

    I paid my subscription just to hear this episode and Tim’s attitude pissed me off the whole way through. Not happy.

  238. Lexicommonzero says:

    https://youtu.be/X9fR1vSxNEQ

    Feel like this is a bit on point for Elijahs perspective
    Cs Lewis man or rabbit

  239. Michael.c.neumeyer says:

    God I love Tim as an intellectual moltov.

  240. Mike_G says:

    Atheism is just refusing all gods proposed so far, it is not a positive position Tim, get it.

  241. saccaed says:

    Double slit experiment simplified. How a measurement or observation is conducted can influence what is being measured or observed. The methods of observing electrons to determine position influence the electrons being observed. If a method for observing electrons at the scale of single electrons that does not influence electrons is developed the observations produced will differ.

  242. Designed_Decline says:

    If God made man in his image, then God is human, hence we are God. If God is a perfect being, then he or it would not desire or require worship. Nor would God care to judge us period. If this notion of God is real and intends to judge us at some point then we are all screwed and I am not sure that I would want to remain in Gods presence for eternity. God did not create man. Man created God and Gods to explain the universe in a way that early mankind could understand and later to enslave the masses and control them. Do as the church commands or else God will judge thee harshly. God is something that we cannot begin to comprehend nor define. Our notion of God places us at the center of it all as if we are that special in the grand scheme. I suggest we cherish and share the moral teachings of Jesus Christ, hold the fear and magic.

  243. ridiz189 says:

    Can we just get AIU on because He’s the atheist guy or the atheist roo and he’s a lot chiller in conversation and isn’t like domineering as some might assume from watching his content. But I think a lot of the debate of this agnostic vs atheist distinction comes from his view and argument on this from years ago. Syd just needs to brush up again on that shit but its all been purged so the conversation has already been hampered by youtubes fucked site so do us all a favor and get the guy on he’s on censored.tv and twitter probably under some thing like he wasn’t jogging or atheistroo idk haha don’t use twitter enough.

    • ridiz189 says:

      My bad Should have put his name Devon Tracey in there somewhere but you’ve had the spawn 😉 he inspired on already like Actual Justice Warrior and I think Sydney Watson was too and the quartering. Not saying they made their channels because of him but he’s been influential in some of the different ideas and philosophies I hear these guys and many others say and that I mostly agree with too lol so get him on to further this convo it be dope lol.

  244. owanobi says:

    As someone who is quite agnostic, I don’t really care about whether god is real or not. There is no way to actually know if god exists. Everyone has their own ‘signs’ that can push them to believe as we all have our own experiences. I am young so there is a good chance that later in life I may have some faith in god. That being said the main reason I don’t believe in a god is that just because some things aren’t explainable with science as we know it right now, doesn’t mean that god had to create it or something to that effect. I also really hate religion as a whole since 1. there are hundreds of them out there, how do you choose which one is the real belief system and which god to follow? 2. A ton of religious people (Elijah included) use their religion as a cudgel against people who do not follow their ideals and treat them as ‘dumb, stupid, or evil’ as Elijah said multiple times in this video. 3. The idea that you have to follow specific tenants or actions to be considered a ‘real’ part of that religion is dumb. There is probably nothing that could convince me that god is real despite him literally showing up in the flesh, which we all know is not going to happen. All ‘visions of god’ happen to be people tripping on drugs or someone who just had a ‘feeling’, it does nothing to convince me. Alternatively I would never not want someone to believe in god because that is their own belief and it gives them purpose. I may not believe in god and think religion is stupid but I cannot deny that religion can give people the will to live and the extremely important morals that a lot of people seem to be missing today. Having religious faith would do nothing for me personally as I feel I am a decent person and I feel if there is a god and heaven, your faith is not what gets you into heaven, it is how kind and compassionate you are. If just faith got you into heaven then a priest that molests children would still get into heaven based on his ‘faith’ alone while I, someone who has not done any such thing would be sent to hell just because I didn’t have faith in a god I could not have known actually existed based on science as we know it. Great episode as always, cheers.

    • Crossedivide says:

      I hear you. I actually came to absolutely know that God exists through a biology seminar by Stephen Meyer believe it or not lol However, I just wanted to mention that the priest molesting children will not have faith to enter the kingdom of God. The book of James talks about how faith without works is dead and how if you show me your works then I’ll show you your faith. Meaning that your actions speak to what you really believe in your heart. The priest cannot love God and molest a child at the same time. It would be like saying that you love your Mom but behind her back you slash her car tires. It’s just something that wouldn’t be done if you actually loved your mom. You don’t go to Heaven just because you’re a priest and say that you have faith. It’s worlds more than that. Just keep an open mind and keep on it. I suggest The Case for Christ by Lee Strobel. I like the video format. Take care

  245. Nova says:

    The only sin that absolutely gets you excluded from heaven is not believing in god. Whole lot of paedophiles that found god in prison are making it in.

  246. Crossedivide says:

    *Tim* first time commenter, the Bible never describes hell as eternal torture. The Bible describes hell as a place of eternal torment.

    Torture is pain that is being inflicted upon you externally; someone cutting into your arm.
    Torment is pain that is being self-inflicted internally; think extreme regret.

    Imagine 10 years ago you had 30 bitcoins that you used to buy a happy meal with. Imagine being a kicker in the NFL and it came down to you to win the Super Bowl and you lost the game. Imagine looking down at your phone while driving and running someone over killing them. We have a sense of what hell is like by the torment that we put ourselves through in this life because of the choices we’ve made. However, the regret that people will feel in hell will be absolute and overwhelmingly unbearable and never ending. The regret will stem from not choosing to be with God when God gave us every opportunity to be with him.

    Using your frame of mind Tim, I imagine hell being the implementation of a pure Communist Dictatorship on a society where sin has been unleashed and knows no bounds and Heaven is the implementation of pure Libertarian Values upon a society where no one will ever chose to sin. Imagine choosing the Communist Society.

    Makes me think of these useful idiots who think that in a communist society they will have their own farm and play guitar everyday… they are literally choosing the Communist Society and if it is ushered in and realized then they are going to have a rude awakening and will deeply regret their decisions while knowing that it is too late to change the outcome. I imagine myself saying, “Hey, I’m sorry but you brought this on yourself. I tried telling you guys, I pleaded with you guys, but you mocked my every attempt. You are responsible for your decisions and they have consequences; you will reap what you have sowed.” I imagine this is much like what God will tell the people of hell.

    Anyway, I hope this helps. I listen to all four of your shows everyday.

  247. MikeM says:

    Wow do you owe me royalties.

  248. DEPoland says:

    There is so much wrong with this guy’s Escatology and Doctrine I don’t even know where to begin. FIRST of all Dispensationalism was created in the 19th century based on Zionism and a preacher named Darby along with the Schofield Bible. Total mess of biblical prooftext run amuck and totally not biblical. No…. we are not getting ruptured. Yes, hell is real. There are plenty of prophecies from Marian apparitions like Our Lady of Fatima that discussed it.

    Where’s Seamus when you need him? Or Jack Posobiec? Straighten this man out.

    • DEPoland says:

      Meant “Raptured” although my mistake was appropriate.
      Tim is accurate in his address of those who never heard the Gospels and there is Encyclicals that addresses this.

    • Cg0osemer says:

      Thank you, I was going to make a similar comment. I just started reading The Warning, compiled by Christine Watkins. It goes through recent Marian apparitions and prophecies about a soon to come Warning (not rapture), where every one on earth will receive a mini-judgement, see all their sins and how they rippled through time and be given a chance to repent and turn the destructive course of humanity around before the real end.

  249. garyha says:

    This is kindergarten where we learn and grow and everything’s going to be ok in a hundred lives or so.
    Thank God for multiple lives b/c I pretty much fucked this one up.
    I’m sorry Nicodemus, you’re too old and set in your ways, you’re going to have to be born again. Something like that, from Jesus.

  250. SquirtForever says:

    Yes. Elijah prays in tongues. I would love to be in that room for this conversation. I was getting antsy that I couldn’t answer Tim’s questions. Apologetics is the best way to confirm God or at least the idea of God. Tim, seek Him. God isn’t church. He is a relationship.

  251. NB4jannies86 says:

    Seek and you will find. You will find what it is you TRULY seek. If you TRULY seek god you will find him. (Or refuse to seek like Sydney) I was agnostic, similar to Tim’s view. I always hated religion, and still do. Religion is a human attempt to define (what is undefinable) and to compartmentalize and categorize god to their own understanding. It was Only when I completely gave up on myself and my own understanding, and seeked out real truth(not my truth), did I make enough space for God to come next to me, and show who God was, and who I am in relation. Even at that point I knew zero about the Bible, several months later, (still hating divisive religion) I pickup up (seeked)a Bible just to see what Jesus says, and my mind was blown. Read jesus’s words/teachings that are highlighted in a “red letter Bible”.
    Elijah was spot on, he just could not come up with the right way to answer Tim in that: God is all that is good, all good comes from God, The spirit of God (good) comes to every soul regardless of any human interaction of influence.

  252. NEXUS-6 says:

    Never trust a person who has never done mushrooms.

  253. Digota says:

    I think not everyone is at the same place in life. People deserve the right to preach if they feel they are “following their inner path to god”

  254. J_Purpleman says:

    I haven’t seen oxygen atoms through an electron microscope, but I hope to some day. Even so, I maintain a deep and abiding faith in oxygen.

  255. KDiddy says:

    Atheism, Creationism, or Intelligent Design, take your pick, you’re barely even capable of understanding given your biology and you’re not expected to have made a correct choice, ever. I think the most beautiful thing is that religions have popped up everywhere and they have similarities! I like Rastafarianism, it’s one of the more recent and relevant to me. Not because I used to love mind altering plants and it allows to do so, but because they have a belief that a certain type of music will free the human mind and facilitate peace on Earth. Rebel Music! I mean, Rasta Music. They believe that the late President of Ethiopia was the reincarnation of Christ, and they follow his teachings and the others before him. I’m not sure I would be well suited to practice Rastafarianism as a religion, but I will alter my mind, that’s for sure. Also, Graham Hancock had written a great book about his search for the the Ark of the Covenant, check it out, called “Sign and the Seal.”

    So, I end with this, lyrics from Mr. Marley and the Wailers, as well as a few speculations… Jesus didn’t write the bible nor the commandments… Buddha didn’t write out the noble truths… Muhammed didn’t write anything, although he did see a burning bush… Joseph Smith wrote out the Mormon Bible and no one takes them seriously.

    Get up, stand up (Stand up for your life) don’t give up the fight!
    Oh I say
    Preacher man, don’t tell me
    Heaven is under the earth
    I know you don’t know
    What life is really worth
    It’s not all that glitters is gold
    ‘Alf the story has never been told
    So now you see the light, eh
    Stand up for your rights
    Get up, stand up (Lord, Lord) stand up for your rights (What you got to give?)

    Get up, stand up: don’t give up the fight!
    Most people think,
    Great god will come from the skies,
    Take away everything
    And make everybody feel high.
    But if you know what life is worth,
    You will look for yours on earth:
    And now you see the light,
    You stand up for your rights. jah!
    Get up, stand up! (jah, jah!)

    Get up, stand up! (keep on struggling on!)
    Don’t give up the fight! (yeah!)
    We sick an’ tired of-a your ism-skism game –
    Dyin’ ‘n’ goin’ to heaven in-a jesus’ name, lord.
    We know when we understand:
    Almighty god is a living man.
    You can fool some people sometimes (* and I love how you fool yourselves because it tickles my brain),
    But you can’t fool all the people all the time.
    So now we see the light (what you gonna do?),
    We gonna stand up for our rights! (yeah, yeah, yeah!)
    Oh, you better:
    Get up, stand up! (in the morning! git it up!)

    “Get up, Stand Up” by Bob Marley & The Wailers.

    In case you’re wondering, Intelligent Design, not Creationism nor Atheism.
    Tim, your argument over “unknown” gases in the air would not withstand basic knowledge of light, matter, and science and I’m not understanding why you continue to make it… Maybe one day I’ll understand… You can make one, a spectrometer. Do you just ask people this question to see if they know a little bit about physics or do you ask it to throw people off?
    If you want to test your faith, walk across a busy freeway at night, don’t question the presence of gases in your breathable atmosphere while you’re doing just fine, Jeez. Otherwise, use your faith as a way to understand yourself. Like, maybe you don’t know all the answers, but you have some decent questions so you don’t assume you know nothing, you assume you know enough to reason through what is unreasonably hard to figure out given what you do and don’t know. You have to start somewhere right? You can at least know you tried, if even though you don’t end up with any understanding at all, nor something to say at the end of your struggle, at least you put some words together to make a question. Maybe that question was something GREAT! Maybe it was just SAD.
    To question Creationsim, I ask, “What is piety.” “What is pious?” “What do the Gods want us to do?” Certainly cleanliness is next to godliness, but are all the activities of the church or humans acting on behalf of the church pious? Just not the Catholics then, huh? Or the Muslims? Or the religions that were not the same as the others? The Taliban? Did they know Jesus? The best thing the Council of Nicea did was give you the saving grace of a next messiah figure in those “scriptures.” Otherwise you’d be stuck reading the scrolls of bumbling followers and would have nothing to look forward to. At least you can believe that one day you’ll be united. And that’s a good thing.
    To question Aetheism, I ask, “Have you truly experimented with nothing?” “Have you created your own sun and left it alone for millions of years? and then come back to it or something? Did I miss that part of NASA history. And then to top it off, whenever we dig, things down there from history are really providing evidence of everything before us. I heard they dug, to the center of the Earth, and found lightning storms and big ‘ole ocean of amino acids spawning primordial life that we’ve barely scraped fossils of, Plus dinosaurs and King Kong and shit.

    Intelligent Design, Atheism, or Creationism… Take your pick. What makes sense to you? I love the idea of things happening for a reason but not because of just one entity or one groups beliefs. Intelligent Design allows me to believe more, and more is better. I am able to believe that even though someone doesn’t know Jesus, they they are still capable of discovering Christ consciousness in life or after death. When it comes to the afterlife, if you believe there is one and you try to explore it, maybe you’ll come across that great gig in the sky, the Kingdom of Jesus and his Father and all their followers. Or maybe you’ll have your own. Atheism would just be boring. There’s really nothing to discuss. For example, you’d hear a noise in the night and have to think, that’s random. That’s out of control careless. True Atheists should just stand next to an inflatable wacky waveable arms tube man and see what randomness happens next. Maybe another lightning strike will happen and then randomly we’ll be warped to Star Trek land because that’s in the realm of “random” bullshit that makes billions of lifeforms sustain life for extended periods of time. I know Atheism has a more tenable structure but I love being dramatic about how dumb it is to think you can combine dirt, water and lightning to create life.
    Intelligent design, all the way for me. It’s not random, someone didn’t cut the boards right and the wind and atmospheric pressure cracked just at the same time as I completed my thought while typing a comment into a episode of Timcast so it was meant to friggin be and it doesn’t make me right, but to me it means I’m doing something right. Now I gotta go to bed. Way past bed time. No time to curate long TLDR comment. Just, press, post comment… I love you all! I stayed up late just to watch, and it was worth not getting off

  256. ProofofParadox says:

    Tim you should look into election a biblical exlanation for what you’re asking about its about being crafted by God and because you are crafted he knows who would and wouldn’t accept him… also there are vessels of wraith that are talked about that might also explain some of the evil and those who don’t choose its all hard to explain in just a comment but look into election (biblically not 2016 or 2020 lol) and vessels of wraith these are both good answers to your questions and I would love to see a follow up if you read this however unlikely

  257. John Tango Mango says:

    Tim is an emo fag from 2005. Why the fuck am I listening to this??? Unsubscribed. You are a child.

  258. garyha says:

    “Why were humans created?”

    God wanted to find out what small limited little pieces of himself would do. His wife agreed.

  259. CaptainFreedom says:

    Tim didn’t treat his Jewish, or guests of any other faith, like this. Tim is cutting him off, arguing against the half points he alows Elijah to get out, putting words in his mouth, trying to trip him up and just acting snide and sarcastic. If you disagree, fine just disagree. We belive you are saved through FAITH, not through works or being a good person. Tim wouldn’t allow every good person in Central or South America to immigrate to the USA just because. GOD doesn’t have to let you in either just because.

    • Margie says:

      Yeah, it was pretty disappointing. I seriously dgaf what he believes but the rudeness was unreal. He would never talk to his Jewish or Muslim guests like that, never has. The belittling nature of it was really difficult to watch.

    • AussieBattler says:

      I get his point. You have a honorable man in an African village. He spends his whole life helping others. He has a wife and kids who he loves and cherishes. He gives his spare food to the needy, he is humble and kind to all he meets. He is not perfect but would be described by anyone as a good person. He dies not having ever heard about God or Christ and therefore could have not had faith. Tim’s point is trying to get to whether that person who lived as a good soul would end up in heaven without needing faith just by being a good person in their time and through no fault of their own never heard of God. I like to think the answer is yes, that through your actions you don’t need to have read the bible or know the stories.

      • texhead says:

        Your story is perfect if it was a cold hearted god who was trying to keep people out of heaven. But that’s not true.
        Your story about the African man is good as it highlights the truth that all men know what is right, it’s not unique to me or you that to kill someone to take their wife is OK. Everyone has the laws of God written in their hearts and know when they are going against God. Romans 1:18 I think.
        I personally believe a man in this position when faced with Jesus would automatically recognise His nature and His holiness and bow before Him. It will be natural for him.
        On the other hand a person who is hard hearted or reprobate, even though they accept the truth at first don’t hold onto it. I am not saying they will be separated from God. Also Romans 1:28
        Jesus didn’t come into the world to condemn the world but to bring salvation.

    • texhead says:

      I thought it was a very good conversation, it is very hard to explain things on the spot when you have a deep thinker asking questions he has already come to conclusions on. But he is open to understand it’s just we don’t have what he needs, only God does. I could probably answer most of his questions if I had the time but a person also has to be ready to receive , intellectual talk alone never convinces people of God. There are a lot of christian intellectuals who are dry and uninspiring even if they have the doctrine right.
      There are a huge amount of internet people who are exploring who God is, it’s very exciting.

  260. Wallyhiggens says:

    I kind of wish I could have been there for this one but I think most of these people were on different pages.

  261. John Tango Mango says:

    STOP INTERRUPTING YOUR GUEST! YOU COME AT THIS SUBJECT LIKE A HIGH SCHOOL FAG! Jesus tim, you are a fucking moron.

  262. PseudoSwede says:

    Dennis Prager likes to say that he “prefer(s) clarity to agreement.”

    That same spirit lives with this show, regardless of guest, and Mr. Prager would make a great guest for the next big ‘religious’ discussion (if available). Will Witt would also be a fun alternate PragerU teammate to have on.

  263. MFnHammer says:

    Great conversation. Great guests.

    Ian didn’t strawman tonight, 👏👏👏!

    Great show, and after show.

  264. AndyfromWrexham says:

    ‘Is there a god?’ is the easiest question in the world. Many sophisticated arguments have been made but the reasoning of an unindoctrinated child is enough. The answer is: “No. Invisible super beings are not real”. It’s so obvious that it’s people motivated by fear of death and the realisation that life isn’t fair and there is sometimes no natural justice. It’s kind of babyish. The christcucks say that atheists don’t want accountability but that’s like me saying that Christians don’t follow the Quran because they don’t want to face the judgment of Allah. They’ve been saying “Jesus will return any time now ” for 2000 years. All gods are false. We don’t get our morals from religion, religion got the morals from us humans. We decide what is good and bad and it’s very unlikely that we’ll suddenly decide that murder and theft are good things. I wish I was immortal and natural justice existed but facts don’t care about your feelings as someone once said.

    • Thequaz says:

      If you so brave and so sure about what you think how about you go brush your teeth with a .45 and put us out of your misery?

    • MFnHammer says:

      Every argument you stated has to do with religions. Do you think any of the ancient texts(of ANY of the worlds religions) are the exact same today, as they were when created? Or is it more reasonable to think people corrupted the texts in order to profit/gain power/corrupt others.

      With that out of the way, I could say it’s ‘stupid'(as you would say) to think a perfect Universe just appeared out of thin air(not actual air). It just so happened that EVERYTHING is perfect to form stars, planets, ect, with just the right amount of gravity/ect to form them. The argument is VERY easy to make that you’d be an idiot to think that. It’s ABSOLUTELY not so black and white.

      • AndyfromWrexham says:

        Yes you’re right about a universe appearing out of nothing sounding stupid, and it’s nice to get a reasoned reply other than “if you’re so sure, why don’t you kill yourself?”. I won’t kill myself because I don’t want my one and only life to end. Anyway, thanks for showing some courtesy to someone who disagrees with you. We should all ‘turn the other cheek’ as Jesus instructed. I converted to Catholicism and was once very religious and studied it obsessively.

  265. garyha says:

    But multiple lives would make sense and is in the Bible. Jesus is real but for a loving creator to have made flawed beings knowing ahead of time by name which ones he would torment forever is hellaciously ridiculous. Boom. Call it translation errors or what have you but God is love and therefore eternal hell cannot exist. Yet, consistent with Elijah’s word there, near-death experiences have had some people going there temporarily because they thought they deserved it. We judge ourselves but eventually all will be just fine. “Is it not written you are gods?”, said Jesus.

  266. Bradshaw says:

    The female guest acted as if she owned the English language…. Chick is an agnostic but refuses to admit it. Was hard to listen to for an hr

    • Thequaz says:

      Yeah for someone with a masters degree she’s about a half a step above mentally retarded

    • garyha says:

      Too harsh. At least as far as this clip she was just trying to survive imho.
      Maybe what “atheists” are really trying to say is more like … I’m not religious-minded and I don’t **like** the Christian God Jehovah, incredibly cruel etc so it doesn’t make sense, furthermore, as for whether we were created by an intelligence way above us, could be, who knows, donno. –atheist?

      To all you who self-identify as “atheists”, try this:
      The Christian God can’t be real but is there a God? … can’t know.

      10.2 million web pages say “There is no God” but if you pin them down, telling them that’s a faith and they can’t possibly know that, they do a mental backflip saying no that isn’t what I’m saying. It’s really frustrating.

  267. Cyprian says:

    Some Christians only do good things be cause they are scared of going to hell, not because they want to do good. Some Goldy people do bad things because they believe as long as they go to confession they will be forgiven. To me this is not genuine good.

  268. dji82 says:

    Elijah has definitely spent too much time listening to the standard Christian narrative, and not enough time just reading the Book. (Wow, he just made that same point, mere minutes after spewing the typical Christian narrative, instead of what is written.) I have used Tim’s argument for years myself. Why would people be condemned for living a morally just life, but not “believing” in a single person written about in a book. Tim also makes better arguments for God than most Christians can. The only problem with this whole thing is that no one has any idea what their own points are. What are they even arguing?
    I also wanted to ask Tim if he has personally confirmed all the laws that he called perfect. Or maybe he has some system he created to monitor all of existence so he knows that there is never any imperfections in it, since he used that to make his point.

  269. dj_robz says:

    “This is why I hate having these kinds of conversations…because it exposes me as vapid and unwilling to consider another viewpoint”

    • Thequaz says:

      Yep. She’s a cowardly idiot that’s believes in the family guy version of god but thinks she’s so above everyone else because she walks in and says “well I’m retarded so I don’t want to hear it”

    • DBurleson says:

      No, she hated it because Tim was attacking her and she wasn’t here for that. No wonder she shut down

      • AgentCooper says:

        Exactlty. Tim cornered her to make his bigger point about the media and it made him look like a jerk. Many believe agnosticism and atheism represent the two opposite ends of the spectrum. I can respect an atheist who admits she ultimately doesnt know. Tim always jumps on Ian about semantics but he was all about that tonight.

        • pantherage says:

          Yep Tim just acted like an outright dick tonight. He’s like a fun vacuum. These guests like joking around and he just attacks them. Would have been more enjoyable with Ian hosting this one.
          Noticed a lot unsubscribing after this.

    • dji82 says:

      Or that she is comfortable with her own beliefs and doesn’t give a shit to change them. I doubt the average Christian is going to entertain the religious reasonings of a Muslim.

  270. koruthaiolos says:

    Nobody expects…

    The TIMCAST INQUISITION!

  271. DBurleson says:

    Great conversation, very fun.
    Tim (not that he reads any of this) stop playing Symantec games between Atheism and Agnosticism.
    All you were doing the entire time with your guest was bully her into saying it.
    Words have meanings and for good reason but you completely lost there. It doesn’t change her beliefs at all, let it go and talk about the ideas.

    • dji82 says:

      Yeah, his “you’re not calling yourself the right thing” argument was pretty weak. Especially after the 5th or 6th time. In the mean time he would also say something like, “I don’t know, I’d be considered a ‘theist’, I guess.” With a little shrug of his shoulders. Doesn’t know what label to give his own beliefs, but sure knows Sydney’s.

  272. thedeugs says:

    the hardest things about being a christian is: 1) following christ’s steps
    2) explaining that God isnt a bearded man floating in the sky to people that believe he is. in fact GOD explains who he is to Moses before the plagues of egypt.

    the bible has been proven over and over and over again people still refuse to believe.

    the answer to why is there evil in world is actually a simple answer. Free will. without evil there can be no good and vice versa. fact of the matter is its all choice. love is an emotion that can only be felt by choice. if its forced its not love.

    • RGCheek says:

      Going to Heaven is not all that difficult. The Creator wants us to be with Him, but our own evil drives him away, so we have to repent from our wrong doing and try to obey Him.
      It isnt all that complex, really

      Micah Chapter 6
      6
      With what shall I come before the Lord
      and bow down before the exalted God?
      Shall I come before him with burnt offerings,
      with calves a year old?
      7
      Will the Lord be pleased with thousands of rams,
      with ten thousand rivers of olive oil?
      Shall I offer my firstborn for my transgression,
      the fruit of my body for the sin of my soul?
      8
      He has shown you, O mortal, what is good.
      And what does the Lord require of you?
      To act justly and to love mercy
      and to walk humbly[a] with your God.

      That just about covers it all, Tim.

    • garyha says:

      Or Jehovah was an alien group violating the galactic non-interference policy and pretending to be God? Ya gotta admit, angels and aliens, hey, if it walks like a duck etc. That would mean 1/3 of today’s alien groups are bad (some know what I’m referring to there) and 2/3rds good

  273. Joshrcp72 says:

    Tim, you sound a bit 1984. What do you believe? I’m atheist. No your agnostic. No I’m atheist. No your agnostic. This goes on for an hour. OK Tim, I’m 1% agnostic. OK so you’re agnostic. No I’m atheist.

  274. Enochulator says:

    so Ian’s a techno-gnostic…

  275. SRT4X4 says:

    Everyone was trying to wifey Sydney until they watched the last 30 minutes of the members only.

    • DBurleson says:

      Ah yes, nothing more unattractive than someone saying I don’t know while being bullied by her host into adopted a title. Truely gross human being right?

  276. J_Purpleman says:

    The punishment of choosing a system other than the good offered by God, and Tim calling that wokeness, seems probably accurate in that they are both religions. But the crux of it could be like trying to explain to a friend that communism won’t work, and that free will, choice, and non-coerced love are what is valuable and essential. Choosing to create a Soviet Union, North Korea, or Democratic Kampuchea (no choice, and compelled ‘caring’ for your brothers) will result in pain, death, destitution, and misery. That punishment will come, because it is what that system creates. The punishment is really self inflicted. And in people there is sometimes a choosing to stick to flawed ideas, even when cracks start to appear in them. And pride or hardening of the heart, or resentment or greed, can cause people to stick to these dreams. Some people want to watch the world burn, and some people want to dominate it, and maybe some people would rather live in a fantasy in their minds. Whether resentment or pride fuels the turning from the good, I think it’s that which condemns the soul, and results in a punishment which couldn’t have been otherwise…and communism, in this metaphor I’m trying to present, turns into it’s own punishment. Evil does oft injure itself, and in the final end, evil probably injures, kills, and torments itself. On a cosmic scale this might be what Elijah is trying to talk about with hell. So humility is a primary virtue in Judeo-Christian tradition, to humble yourself and not let that resentment or pride overtake you and turn your heart from the good.

  277. MissMal92 says:

    ✴️Tim,
    Your unyielding method wasn’t very accommodating for Sydney’s understanding of your message (the basisis with which to determine faith.)
    In order to have a more productive conversation with a person of preexisting ambivalence, it would behoove you to incorporate empathy into your approach. Ian can help you get in touch with your ‘Jordan Peterson’ side. 😉
    That being said, I was thoroughly impressed with your insightfulness in disproving her lack of concern for her direction of ‘belief’. I was shocked and surprised at how the logic hit me. Not so much for her, unfortunately she had already closed her mind to furthering the exploring the ideas.
    As a woman (if the advice is welcome), maybe you can try ‘asking’ instead of ‘telling’- to coax her into being convinced instead of being on the offense/argumentative side.
    Again, a therapistic technique comes to mind…

    Just a few thoughts 😁 Y’all are my favorite thing in my day- my treat!

    This was my favorite episode of the year.

    You guys rock ❤️

    Mallory, Arizona

    • DBurleson says:

      Great insight Mallory 😊
      I agree, he lost Sydney like 10 minutes in and just came off as an asshole (I would even argue a little Authoritarian in this moment).
      Also that is my favorite part about Ian, he brings love and understanding to the show which is a breath of fresh air. Even with his wacky ass ideas 😂

  278. RausV77 says:

    Love Elijah giving it his best shot and I admire him for it. He still has a lot to learn of theology and apologetics. Knowing what you believe, why, and how to explain that to someone who is clearly hostile to the gospel is a whole different Colosseum. I wish Tim would have a legit theologian on to answer his questions. A lot of well known scientists and philosophers are Christians, get someone on like J Warner Wallace, Voddie Baucham, Jeff Durbin, or John MacArthur. Love what you do Tim and crew (obviously) but if you have legit questions you want answers to get someone on that knows not just some people with political backgrounds who are Christian. God Bless 🙏🏿

  279. Bittalion says:

    Elijah dodged your questions for a long time in the beginning of this, but lemme answer quick.
    Will people go to hell because they don’t know the name of Christ? No
    We see this in the New Testament, that the dead “in Christ” awaken when Christ goes to hell after dying, before resurrecting. After resurrection those people are brought with Christ into heaven. This is clearly told to show us that there is more to the eternal life through Christ equation than we may even realize.
    Also in the New Testament, it is said explicitly that “God is love,” it’s also said that those who love (Corinthians 1:13 defines love) know Christ and he dwells in them. Those who Christ knows are vouched for. Also faith, hope and love remain but the greatest of these is love… in conclusion even if you don’t know the names or the correct formula, if you know live your life with Godly love then you know God through knowing Christ.

    • leadd1 says:

      We see this in the New Testament, that the dead “in Christ” awaken when Christ goes to hell after dying, before resurrecting. After resurrection those people are brought with Christ into heaven. This is clearly told to show us that there is more to the eternal life through Christ equation than we may even realize.

      I never thought of it that way, thanks for the insight!

  280. dji82 says:

    Yeah… Tim is generalizing the religion based on the understanding of one person. I see this often. People attach one person’s failure to express their beliefs to everyone who has those beliefs. I personally do not believe that people are condemned to hell for simply not knowing Christ. That said, Christians do have a tendency to go with the “established” meaning of Bible quotes. For example, Christ said, “no one gets to the father, but through me.” Christians typically interpret that to mean you must believe in or follow Christ to be allowed into heaven. Why can’t it mean that Christ is the gate keeper, and has to approve your entry? The primary problem with Christians, myself included, is that we read the Bible to fast, or not at all.

    • garyha says:

      I like your point. And a lot could be lost in translation. For an example on the edge:
      When Jesus said to Peter, “you are a rock, and upon this rock I will build my church” …
      Everyone around understood the pun, Peter means stone, so what if–since Peter was being Peter (punchy)–he was maybe really saying …
      Peter, you hardhead, upon this I am to build my church?
      I apologize to those who would see this as blasphemy but scribes being scribes might have had sarcasm go right over their heads. (And did they even have question marks back then???? Sincere question)

      That comes from a version presumably translated straight from the Aramaic existing in India that clarified a lot of those things, I guess. In it, as the story goes, there was a myth at the time if one walked the shore of Galilee(?) at night they would be killed by demons. And Jesus walked **by** the water(s) rather than **on** the water, meeting them on the other side to prove it false. For example.

      Meanwhile Jesus is very real imho but what religion has done to him is the reason he said about some of them that he will “spit them out of his mouth” if I recall the quote correctly.

      Team evil fears him in part knowing he cannot be fooled as we live on a planet drowning in deception.

      I realized what really bothers me is how easily people buy into deception, far more than evil testing us, it’s their job.

  281. Thequaz says:

    Tim is such a smarmy “I’m the smartest in the room” cunt. He refuses to listen to anything or consider any view that doesn’t already fit his little mold of how things should be. Pride goeth before the fall Timmy

    • Thequaz says:

      And Syd is so damn stupid she doesn’t even know what words mean so she says you’re wrong because I don’t attribute the same meaning to this word as you do. You have a degree you empty headed sow. Oped a fucking dictionary sometime. Hold shit

    • mountain.drew411 says:

      Someone must be extremely logical and christian to explain it to Tim, it seems like he quit when learning that if you know who Christ is and what he desires for your life and you reject it then you will be choosing condemnation. Basically being prideful and saying you know more than God and you’re going to do things your way when you’ve been shown that God knows better than you. That’s what Tim is struggling with, his intellect gets in the way of true understanding, little ironic.

  282. dd54 says:

    Tim, I’d say you are not far from the kingdom of God. He says when you seek me you will find Me. You ask how God judges people so read Romans 2: 11 -16.

  283. KUN_AgueroO0 says:

    I’ve seen all the members only video. This was so frustating to watch lol

  284. GenXBikerMatt says:

    Elijah, you did a great job. You are doing His work. God bless young man.

  285. John_Beart says:

    That was fun.. 😁👍🖖❤️🙏

  286. andy86 says:

    Interesting conversation. Elijah described God like a quantum computer. Everyone else is looking for ones and zeros.

  287. harumph says:

    Wow, Tim put on an absolute clinic with critical thought and conversation control on this one. Absolute legend. No offense to the guests, but Tim is in an entire different universe of being a conversationalist than these two.

  288. brandon_jang says:

    Tim is the most rational on matters of theology out of the bunch! Elijah doesn’t set forth good logical arguments and this is why I have issues with a lot of Protestants. There seems to be even more of a logical disconnect with Sydney. I think Michael Knowles and Dennis Prager (the latter of whom would especially clear things up from the rational perspective) would be much better in addressing Tim’s very legitimate questions.

  289. Jayenoh says:

    you can’t agree because she’s using “her definition” of atheism. if people can’t agree on the meaning of words then nobody can have a conversion and confusion ensues – eg the new definition of the word “vaccine”

    • DBurleson says:

      Yeah but this isn’t a high stakes discussion unlike vaccines. All Tim was doing was bullying her into “changing her label” and it shut Sydney down

  290. DrewishAF says:

    Just the concept of “Hell” doesn’t make any sense to me, nor has it ever. Why would God even make Hell? From what I’ve been told, we were apparently placed on Earth to basically be God’s pets. We were given free will and allowed to make any choices we want. We were also apparently given a very limited set of instructions and told that our decisions would be judged on the “good-bad” spectrum.

    We were also told that God is all our ‘father’ and that he is all-knowing, all-seeing, all-powerful, and all-good. Despite that, he apparently decided one day to give us the silent treatment for the past 2000+ years even though he formerly micromanaged all of the people on Earth. So now we have a father who wants us to believe in him but also refuses to interact with us or answer our questions to save us from ourselves.

    Regardless of the mixed signals above, there is NO point in there that leads me to believe that a benevolent creator would make an eternal prison to condemn his children after making some bad choices. I mean, doesn’t that seem a little harsh? Eternal damnation for finite crimes? Not to mention we didn’t exactly get the full set of instructions, he gave us the damned cliff notes and a “best of luck” encouragement.

    If that were the case (God choosing to punish the creations he adores without end) and God really did create a Hell for us, then he’s not benevolent. If he didn’t create Hell (but instead use it for his own means) then he’s not all-powerful. If he didn’t see that (the fear we have of going to) Hell would inspire so many people to do commit terrible acts for God’s justice, then he isn’t all-knowing.

    It just doesn’t make sense for a creator to decide that ~80 years of being a dick is worthy of infinite ♾️ torment towards his own very creation.

    • RausV77 says:

      Hey I use to have that same view of Hell, use to debate people on it regularly lol then I came to Luke 16:19-to the end of the chapter and it clearly showing something that completely contradicts the thought of what is annihilationism. Thats scripture, I would hope you go and check it out from the words of Christ. God Bless 🙏🏿

      • garyha says:

        I think that’s the only actual reference to “hell” as we think of it but remember it was a parable.
        “to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.”
        He spoke using hyperbole.

        If we take that one story in the Bible’s 783,137 words to mean a loving creator made flawed beings knowing ahead of time by name which ones he would torment forever, that’s fear-driven.

        As I understand it, quote:
        “Four different words are translated as hell in the King James Version, one in the Old Testament
        (Sheol) and three in the New Testament (Hades, Gehenna, and Tartarus). On careful
        examination it will be found that none of these four words has the meaning of our modern word
        “hell,” which is a place of eternal torment.”

        Same with heaven, three words all translated as “heaven” for us … the air around us, the atmosphere around earth, and the cosmos out there, something like that. So “heaven” as we think of it ought to really be taken as something not. this. earth. and “In my father’s house [universe] are many mansions [planets]” … “I go to prepare a place for you [some other planet surely than this lovely blue orb cesspool of deception]”.

        “weeping and gnashing of teeth” is in the marriage feast parable, words by the king in that made-up story, and six others times yet it became cemented in our minds as a description of a burning eternal hell (by our loving God for any who don’t say the 12 magic words at some point during their life, i.e. “I accept Jesus Christ into my heart as my Lord and Savior”), thanks to our pastors. Nah, we’ve been deceived and controlled through fear.

        More likely we are evolving beings, a system set up by a loving Creator, starting as the consciousness in a stone, then fully bored upgraded to a blade of grass, a flower, a bug, fish, bird, cat or dog and then Bob getting into fights at bars in Tennessee who becomes the ruler of Zimbabwe after 6 lives but then starts to evolve and mature, the father of four girls on Maui 14 lives later.

        What’s the use of this nursery? Your guess is as good as mine. I’m guessing it’s training for a Star Trek sort of thing where maybe we tend other planets as we are tended to now by the angels/aliens. And not even one of us will be lost.

        Forever is a long time so don’t anybody feel rushed in growing up, enjoy the ride.

  291. RuthlessAdmin says:

    Existence is a paradox.

  292. Mbarstow07 says:

    I wish I could be there for this one. I’ve felt god the way Elijah has, but I’ve always doubted the way God is taught like Tim. Every time I look for an answer to my questions, I’m left with more questions. I believe the bible is complete for most, but is limited by man’s comprehension. I’ve lost what Elijah has over time mainly due to my own stubbornness, and I understand but am saddened by Tims inability to see what Elijah sees, probably because I feel the same way in my heart with Tims ethical argument. Even though I know it’s wrong, which is the condemnation that Tim can’t see in Elijah’s argument. Irony.

  293. Anno713 says:

    Ian, I love the way you think man. You think so outside the box that you have fucking lost sight of it.

  294. Starchuk says:

    Good show .

  295. DavidJay says:

    Yo, just fucking drop it my guy holy shit xD

  296. Texasrob@patriot says:

    Why so difficult?!!
    The heart of man is deceitful. There is LITERALLY NOTHING WE CAN DO TO CHANGE THAT. Our best works are like filthy rags. Jesus took all of our sins. ALL. and HE suffered the price so we don’t have to. And with the gratitude GIVEN BY THE HOLY SPIRIT, we live better but still keep on sinning because that’s who we are. Natural born sinners. But we, by accepting the free gift of Christ’s sacrifice, are spared from that consequence. So Jesus does the dying, the Holy Spirit does the changing, and we live better lives from a grateful place. It’s AWESOME. BECAUSE we literally ONLY have to believe, accept, and give thanks. God does ALL of the heavy lifting. THAT is why I try to love and help my fellow man/woman.

  297. Dinstaar says:

    Wow Tim went full flat earther type at the end.

  298. Pardah83 says:

    Schaffer is based , don’t believe it yet. Just wait……

  299. TheMaybeTroll says:

    OK, different points Tim should learn about. Age of accountability and how it corresponds with salvation. The act of salvation is the act of humbling oneself before the Lord and as The Bible says “before honor is humility an the fear of the Lord is the wisdom of man”. So before the spirit of the Lord can descend upon you, you must declare your faith in Jesus Christ. The only perfect sacrifice Who took the sins of the world upon himself that those who believe in him would be presented before God As beings made new and spotless or born again of the spirit. This is what’s known as grace through faith. Grace is undeserved mercy granted to us by Christ’s death. An the reason why people end up in hell for eternity it’s because without that consequence you would be robbing the authority of Christ’s death on the cross to save those who accept him for eternity. The whole point of this dog and pony show Is the reconciling of man back to God which happens after the rapture, then the 7 year tribulation, Then 1000 year kingdom of Christ, Then the release of satan back on to the world and the gathering of his forces for the battle of Armageddon. The victory of Christ over Satan ending in Satan’s chaining to hell. An then the destruction of the old earth and old heaven. Then the remaking of the new earth and new heaven in which Mankind and their new bodies will reside on the new Earth purged of sin.

  300. jwschwalb says:

    So Ian just invited scientology there…..

  301. William07182 says:

    Loved seeing Tim rile everyone up. You should have explained it with Sim Theory though, our universe is like a container and the initial Big Bang is the glitch, the point at which the laws of the universe are violated and all matter is created. This container (universe) didn’t just fill itself. Anyways, one can then add on the religious layer once that initial foundational step of a God existing is established.

  302. Derkacast says:

    If someone hasn’t encountered the holy Bible or heard of Christianity, doesn’t mean they won’t be “punished”, it’s ridiculous to think people that if someone murders someone wouldn’t feel guilty, typically, I’m assuming, they will feel guilty internally… or someone stealing, or cheating on your spouse… they know it’s wrong internally. So the more knowledge, from what I gather, of the Christ/God and the Bible, you’re more harshly punished vs someone who doesn’t know of christ and these moral laws he lays out. Just because you’re ignorant of the law doesn’t make you innocent or you get a free pass, I bet it’s the same way with God, if christ is the truth.

    Get Cliffe on “give me an answer” YouTube, he actually gives you a answer on “Do anyone who doesn’t know our Christian God, go to hell?” And more. This guy actually goes onto college campuses, and talks/ have discussions with them with your questions/opinions. He makes pretty good “arguments” about Christ.

  303. Donald says:

    “There is no path to heaven but through me.”

  304. Kwani says:

    A little tough to listen to this. Elijah is a good dude but he’s no theologian. That allows for a lot of very superficial translation on his part. Not his fault but it doesn’t play out well for people who really have doubts about this issue.

  305. Smokingburrito says:

    Tim and all check this Link out in regards to you thinking you know what is going on with the double slit. They’ve modified it
    https://youtu.be/H6HLjpj4Nt4

  306. GreMIO420 says:

    Sorry Tim. An atheist posits, there is no god. An agnostic would be more likely to say, I don’t think there is a god.

  307. BefallenLegate says:

    Elijah is a good boy. He’ll understand it if he were to take a chance to read the letter jude wrote before the revelation. Or, he can go to church and listen to the loud guy begging for change. The funniest part is that he can’t feel the magnetic algorithm which is resonating love tword his good heart and yet something is coming to get him? Nah. We’ll all figure it out eventually.

  308. CQ5150 says:

    As a side note from my last comment. We all need to pray for Tim and hope that something encourages him to at least learn with an open mind. Prayers coming your way, Tim.

  309. Grand_Kai says:

    O no…36:01, No, Tim they evolved the experiment to measure farther down the road and actually impacted the previous study. Meaning them measuring in another point actually impacted the interaction from light that should impact sooner then what was measured. It’s literally one of the biggest issues with quantum physics today. Talk about knowing a little, and it distorting your understanding, (Tim’s version of the hippies).

    • Toddius says:

      I wanted to ask same question. I don’t understand that delayed measurement and quantum eraser experiments. But as I see them, is that if there is way, for information get out of system, universe will chose to use another algorithm to calculate path of photons, and apply it retroactively.

      • Grand_Kai says:

        That would be one theory of why it happens, considering we don’t understand why it does. However we do know that it does happen and that’s why I chuckled at Tim. Funny enough the “smart guy” in the room was Schrodinger. Hey proposed the famous cat experiment to show how ludacris the idea of two states existing at the same time until measured. Ironically we now use that to try and explain what he was trying to break down.

        Now if you where to describe to the Universe being a perfect code as Tim states, my question would be, then what is a black hole?

  310. Cplenny says:

    Why does pi go on for infinity? Talk your way out of that one Tim.

  311. CQ5150 says:

    I’m a big fan of Tim… But I don’t like seeing him this way. For someone that attempts to learn and hear all sides he shut down and just rambled on like an idiot. Heaven forbid you let someone talk and try to learn on a topic you are uneducated. You alienated your Christian audience, not on your personally beliefs but your ignorance short sidedness. I couldn’t finish a Tim episode for the very first time.

  312. Georgiegirl1216 says:

    The word of God is written on every heart. Please read the Search for Jesus and the Case for Jesus.

  313. Skynetink86@gmail.com says:

    Today is the 21st anniversary of my grandmother’s death. She not only went to church everyday she worked there. She suffered her whole life with type 1 diabetes. She had 6 kids with 2 husband’s who both died before I got to meet them. I once set the bible on fire I do not believe in god as an entity at all. Why am I still here and my grandmother is not? How about between Biden and trump one of them is the devil where is god?
    God is the conscience in your head you do evil you go crazy and live in a bad world ie hell. If you’re rich your living in fake heaven and if you believe in God as a person your crazy . When you win money and feel good that’s God when you share your winnings and a few weeks later you get a promotion at work that’s god rewarding your good. When you fall in love that’s God when she cheats leaves and takes half your shit that’s devil a friend sold drugs his son died of an od from that drug years later after he stopped selling. That’s God at work. Not the od but the punishment of the dealer

  314. jhudler says:

    Electrons, Protons, Neutrons are destroyed practically everyday at CERN

    • Grand_Kai says:

      I asked my Science teacher, “If you had the perfect piece of glass duplicated, multiple times. and threw it at a wall the same way every time. It would shatter into the exact same pieces. So why do you we assume these are the break down’s of the element when in fact we are taking a perfect substance and slamming it into a wall.”

      I just wish he would have made a compelling argument.

  315. GreMIO420 says:

    Wow, I’m not a Christian, but I’ve had no issue listening to shamus’ after shows, nor michael knowles episodes. But Christ, this shouldn’t be the Elijah shouldn’t be allowed to speak of this. I smoke rocks

  316. GreMIO420 says:

    Wow, I’m not a Christian, but I’ve had no issue listening to shamus’ after shows, nor michael knowles episodes. But Christ, this shouldn’t be the Elijah shouldn’t be allowed to speak of this.

  317. Grandeandy419 says:

    Damn, Love the conversation… but Damn do i need a cigarette!

  318. Chimerawizard says:

    I used to be Christian, then I learned about mind control. What is free will when you can be reprogrammed to no longer have it? And why should anyone believe in a god who fails to ensure it isn’t robbed from us?

    Elijah: dark matter has been proven false. Pretty sure you also repeated some other dis-proven theories. At least try to prove God through the lens of an ignorant non-christian. Don’t go ‘in the weeds’ with your explanation. K.I.S.S. must be applied to these arguments.

    Tim, agnostic/athiest? just let her definition be wrong because she obviously has no interest in the topic.

  319. ChrisChaosX says:

    Amazing conversation guys.

  320. Stephen Menard says:

    Tim was being ridiculous with his arguments tonight.

  321. DorseyWoods says:

    One huge element was completely left out of this conversation that answers the “how do you know” question. It may or may not satisfy someone who isn’t open to the notion, but the answer is FAITH.

  322. Clayton says:

    Tim is arguing about the spiritual world with science and arrogance. He says we cannot possibly understand God yet he acts as if he knows it all. Maybe I misunderstand his point but that’s what it sounds like to me. Also, getting loud and angry shows he is frustrated. Not a strong point.

  323. Jarvis says:

    A three way debate between an agnostic, a Christian, and a milque toast fence sitter.

  324. DJLaserz says:

    I’m only 20 minutes in as of writing this comment, but in that time Elijah and Tim together have made more compelling arguments to me that God exisits than I have heard my whole life.

  325. NeoN says:

    Jesus CHRIST this kind of Christian is so insufferable; so arrogant believing that your interpretation of ANYTHING is 100% literally true. Your life should be your sermon; fuck these proselytizing assholes.

  326. ShooterMcKevin says:

    The hell argument is BS. If you believe in scripture and not the modern religion, it makes more sense that you would just cease to exist when you die. The bible mentions a second death within the lake of fire. Annihilationism makes the most sense. Poof, you’re gone.

    I’m a former Christian, and these are one of the many arguments that led me away.

    When you’re a progressive and you believe the nuances of progressivism, many will argue amongst themselves about them. Christians are no different.

  327. Danhenry918 says:

    WTF… HELL is a state of mind Heaven is the awaken consciousness we choose

  328. Grand_Kai says:

    Ok, I’m at 24 min in, and I will say this. Those that do not know of GOD, would know of the nature of God, and those that know of God are held to the higher standard.

    Meaning that someone that didn’t know God would still feel his presence. How everyone knows when they are doing something that is wrong, or right by the absence of feeling ill over a decision. Take the latest TicToc celeb that knew it was wrong to leave her child home alone (evident by stealing detergent from a house party and lying), she rejected God. That is why lying is a sin, not saying “ya those pants don’t make you look fat”, but lying to cover what you knew was wrong, in sense you are doubling down on your original sin.

    So those that know God, know what his teaching is, and know what to avoid so a slip up is looked at more strictly. Those that do not, still know, what they do, feels wrong or feels right. I’m not talking about feeling righteous from others, IE filming myself giving a homeless person a sandwich and posting it for clout. I’m speaking of those that see someone drop 50 dollar’s on the ground pic it up and bring it back to them. Or Dive into a raging river to save children from drowning, compared to the man that wished he would have but was frozen by shock. This is your answer Tim, the ignorant are not abandoned, but the ones that know the most are held to a higher standard.

    Why are they heled to a higher standard? If you knew doing A.) would give you this, and B.) would give you this you could fake being A. So you need to live every aspect as you truly where A and not just an actor.

    That is what this man is trying to say.

  329. steveo says:

    i thought Jesus would not return until all have heard and had a choice to choose to accept or reject

  330. JasonTM says:

    You ahould try and get David Wood if for a really good session about theology.
    He does Act17Apologetics on YouTube.

    • TheJester says:

      I agree. He would be the ultimate theology person to have on Timcast. I am still impressed with Elijah’s knowledge of theology though bc he doesnt come across as a person so invested in Christianity. David Woods testimony is crazy.

  331. UunholyBacon says:

    always press record early Tim. and GOD IS GOOD! this is so juicy i love theology talk.

  332. VannicWolf says:

    Elisha LOST, SO HARD. a TON of non-answers.

  333. Clayton says:

    So Tim is a Calvinist.

  334. TheJester says:

    To Sydney’s point of polytheism….in the original Hebrew text it says “we” made him in his image. The word is “elohim” and it means “God” and there isnt a hebrew word for “angel” so…Yahweh, in essence, is the “God of gods” …a “spirit being” and the other Angel’s are also “spirit beings”…look up “micheal heiser” he has really answered questions I have had about Christianity. …His work is controversial, but he has answered many of my questions I have had for years. It ties in perfectly to my belief that aliens are fallen Angels.

  335. villetaj says:

    Tim, have this conversation with a catholic. Michael Knowles would be great. He would walk circles around all your arguments.

  336. alternativejk says:

    When it comes to theology, I would recommend guys like John McCray (Whaddo you meme?) or Mike Winger YouTube channels. They are able to have a full discussion on Christianity and theology

  337. dadof2 says:

    Here’s a simple answer to the first question!!! While in this life, God does show Himself to all creation, whether some people recognize Him by the name Jesus. So if you die without ever hearing the bible or someone utter the name Jesus, but you have chosen to live for God in the most possible way you could, then I believe God will grant them mercy.

  338. Jk79 says:

    Elija failed. He’s speaking “Christianese” to people that don’t understand the language. He keeps using words and phrases that are loaded with meaning to himself based on what he’s been taught. He hasn’t actually thought through the legitimate and hard questions. He’s just repeating the platitudes he’s learned in church and they aren’t coherent or logical.

    • TheJester says:

      I disagree. I used to be atheist and am now Christian and I believe pretty much the exact thing that Elijah does. This is something a person wrestles with and thinks about for a long time, i think he has done his own research and come to his own conclusions, as have I. I do recognize it is hard for nonbelievers to understand or digest and they often get angry, that’s the standard response.

      • mslushin says:

        Then what do you believe Jesus died for, if Sin is absolute regardless of one’s knowledge of God?

        I was raised Christian, and was taught that Jesus died to absolve man of absolute Sin, and that all that is needed to enter the kingdom of heaven was acknowledgement of the divine, regardless of the form it takes. Acknowledgement that man is flawed, and that a higher power exists, to which we are a flawed creation.

        What Elijah was preaching was old testament. That only those who accept the Catholic God, acknowledge and beg forgiveness for their sin, keep to the testament as laid out in the Bible and spread the word, are accepted to heaven.

        It took me awhile to understand, but I was once told that to truly understand Christianity means to accept that even Hitler went to heaven.

    • Mr.Arnold says:

      There’s always an excuse….

  339. Lastandtheleast says:

    Elijah was not prepared for this at all. Tim. I challenge you to read the entire Bible from start to finish, if you are so interested in this topic. And then, after all of that, make your decision about Jesus, but not before.

  340. DMC82 says:

    Don’t want to understate the problems in Australia right now, the situation is beyond fucked up. However I want to point out an important dichotomy between the USA and Australia for those that are chortling at the cucked Aussies;

    This country would NEVER, EVER tolerate the bullshit the USA tolerated from BLM/Antifa last year. Not in a million years. The cops would have beat the everliving shit out of them, and ordinary citizens would have beat the everliving shit out of them. Both countries have the same disease but different symptoms.

  341. Davidfish says:

    Comply! It’s okay when I agree with it.

  342. KMerckCPA says:

    Took half a second to emcode like alwqys. And my phone’s a Galaxy S9. Get better phones people or stop whining!!

  343. thoth says:

    Tim is the swine in “Do not cast your pearls before swine”.. he just cannot get it.

  344. TheJester says:

    I spent my life making the wrong decisions. At some point I had to put my own ideas aside and follow Christ. I appreciate this convo. Good talk on eschatology. And yes, complete submission is the only way, Tim. Because submission to a better, all-knowing plan for my life was always a better choice than my flawed human decisions.

  345. NeverMetTheGuy says:

    So it took about an hour to encode, and it’s an hour video, therefore if they mention how long the video is when initially uploading, then we’ll know how long the wait will be.

    Sure, this is an absolute nitpick, but nobody needs to do shit about it if they don’t want to, which seems fair. Happy Midnight, errrybody.

  346. AvengerXP says:

    And we are live at 480p, go!

  347. michaelotis says:

    For those wondering, when it says “Encoding Video” that means that Timcast has uploaded the video successfully to Rumble, however it takes Rumble’s servers this long to process the video and convert it into a desired format for their platform to stream. It appears it takes Timcast about 5-10 minutes to upload but over an hour for Rumble to encode. Just food for thought.

  348. TheDarkworld says:

    Me alone in the corner never being excited by *anyone’s* religious discussion

  349. jamesONguyen says:

    Why must Tim golden shower his esteemed guests and co-hosts???

  350. TwoChains says:

    Catholic me is just sitting here and ignoring all the heresy. This would be the ultimate religious discussion if Knowles or Seamus was also with you guys. It’s cool to listen to the other religions.

    • NeverMetTheGuy says:

      Don’t leave out Yossi. It would be pretty sic if there could be a Members Only bonus one day of an ultimate no holds barred religious discussion with all of them in the same room.

      • arakitai says:

        A friend of mine who’s a career waiter at a posh restaurant got real drunk with me in my back yard. I’ll never forget his musings that night: “Hey. The thing that gets me about religion is that all of them are wrong except one. And what if God is an asshole? What if the actual true religion came and went 30,000 years ago by a prophet hermit who never had a chance to share it with anyone because he died on the way down the mountain from a staph infection. Had he not stubbed his big toe, the world would be at peace. But now we’re all going to hell except for that guy. And he’s a daffy idiot who probably spends his days in heaven growing beets.”

  351. michaelotis says:

    If you go here, you can see the percentage of the encode, at the end it says:

    “encoder”:”encoder”:{“percent”:5},”sys”:{“pct”:5,”msg”:”Encoding video”}}

    Just refresh to get an updated percentage.

    https://rumble.com/embedJS/ulf6yv/?request=video&ver=2&v=vjbhwr&ext=%7B%22ad_count%22%3A%7B%7D%7D&ad_wt=1

    • NeverMetTheGuy says:

      That literally IS the last line, which was surprising for some reason. Really interesting to see things like that on the interwebz, since there’s always something new to learn (which was new, and learny for me). Thanks for that Michael. Or maybe it’s Mic Haelotis, or Michaelo Tis. Michaeloti S. I’m gonna go with Mic Haelotis.

  352. NeverMetTheGuy says:

    At least the people in charge of uploading actively mentioned “It’s a long one” tonight, so I’m okay with this; last night took about a half hour at this point, so I’m guessing it’s a minute per minute to encode.

    With that said, it would be useful if the uploading person could mention in that line how long the segment is, and then we can start working out how long encoding time is per minute of actual video… I mean, we’re already waiting, so it’ll give us something else to do.

  353. T.E.N. says:

    The price we pay for getting around AWS.

  354. AvengerXP says:

    Ah crap not Jesus Talk. What a wasted segment if thats the entire hour.

  355. RedCan_Rick says:

    Sweet Baby Jesus let’s get this show goin!

  356. DavidJay says:

    LOL Tim stay pissin everyone off and I’m here for every bit xD

  357. AstronautFarmer says:

    ready to see tim piss everyone off!